Ian & Stuart's Australian Mac: Not for Sale/Another.not.for.sale (Australia).iso/no need to argue/kurt.is.dead

Text File | 1994-10-01 | 265KB | 6,964 lines

KURT IS DEAD - one shot net.zine!
Ed. by Thomas Leavitt ([e-mail])

CONTENTS:
(use the search functions of your pager or text editor to search
by CAPITALIZED words and phrases for what interests you)

EDITORIAL
ORGANIZATION

SOUL SCREAM - by Thomas Leavitt ([e-mail])
INTERNATIONAL POP OVERTHROW - Jesse Garon ([e-mail])
SLACKER DEMIGOD? * - Paul Tyrell ([e-mail])
JESU KURTE * - Ritchie Eppink <[e-mail]>
WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE? * - John Kelin ([e-mail])
SONG AND VOICE * - Eu-Ming Lee ([e-mail])
KURT COBAIN TRIBUTE - Mik Stevens <[e-mail]>
    * indicates I picked the title

NET-CAPTURES:
ELEGY - couple of 'em
NIRVANA SINGER KURT COBAIN DEAD from Reuters News Service
BOWIE - Lyric from Rock'n'Roll Suicide
FRONT PORCH - tribute song
DETAILS excerpts - Kurt speaks about stomach pain and herion.
KURT AND GAYS - included is a cross posting containing excerpts
from an article where Kurt talks about growing up in Aberdeen and
being beaten to shit repeatedly because he was thought to be gay.
PERFORMANCE ARTIST - Kurt as...
LESTER BANGS ON PETER LAUGHNER - the more things change, the more
things stay the same, impassionate, startlingly relevant to today
INSIDERS ACCOUNT - anonymous post by someone who knew someone
close to Kurt, tells about last days and frantic search
EXCERPTS FROM KURT'S NOTE in Boston Globe article
STELLA BLUE - by the Grateful Dead
KURT AS MEDIA PERSONALITY - long, thoughtful net post, very good
DISCOGRAPHY - list of all the ablums and assorted tracks
LENNON LYRICS - Yer Blues and Working Class Hero
NEVERMIND LYRICS
MEDIA SUMMARY - net person summarizes media coverage, includes
TIMELINE - of Kurts last days
POEMS - haiku and other stuff
SARTRE - excerpt appropos
COURTNEY READS KURTS NOTE - plus, where you can find a .WAV
(digital recording) of this. -the end



EDITORIAL

Kurt is dead. We all know that by now, unless we live in some
gawdawful place where the significance of this rates somewhere
beneath the dogcatcher recall election.

So, I've collected the best stuff from the alt.music.nirvana
newsgroup and solicited a bunch of articles.

Think of this as a tribute

My initial reaction was: "What? oh shit! goddamn, that pisses me
off... 'why'd you have to go and do it, Kurt?'

Man, we lost decades of music. Fuck, someday I'm gonna be fifty
and he'll have been dead longer than he was alive, and I'll
wonder what might have been.

Freaks me out, he was only 5 years older than I am... what the
hell? Just goes to prove money don't buy happiness... manic-
depressive, boy do I know that: just about every male in my
family 'cept me has it. Not fun. Poor Kurt... man, the music just
reached right into my insides and YANKED.

Aw, hell, man, why'd you have to go and do it? Fuck... first
River, the dude who always picked *good* movies, now Kurt... Gen-
X takes another couple hits to the gut.

Anyway, for what it's worth here it is: kurt is DEAD ... long
live the music.



ORGANIZATION

First, a series of articles I solicted over the Internet, then a
series of captures I picked out of newgroups in a couple marathon
sessions and edited into a readable form. I read somewhere that
research indicates that best screen readability is 60 words
across or less, large indentations, and 2 pages or less. Well, I
hit two out of three, in most cases. Tell me what you think. I'm
going to eventually put this in a hypertext linked WWW page, so
it'll be more manageable, but for now, this is it, straight
ASCII. Pointers to the more important stuff are included in the
table of contents.

[As you can see, I've Hyperlinked it. :) Fun. -ED]

ARTICLE ONE
************************************************************
Sent to Minneapolis area newspaper that was looking for comments
from people on-line, Fri, 15 Apr 94 5:03:50 PDT:


SOUL SCREAM
Thomas Leavitt ([e-mail]) (editor)


    Kurt Cobains music reached right into the core of my
consciousness and YANKED... it expressed the primal scream that
echoes at the edge of my consciousness whenever I deal with the
insanity of the world.

    NEO-NAZI's were on my campus the other day... and the school
paper managed to find two dorfs who actually let themselves be
put on record saying, "They've got a lot of good points...".
THEIR NAMES WERE IN THE PAPER for Chrissakes! Unbelievable.

    The music always seemed to teeter on the abyss... there was
a quality of suspension to it. Over the past few years, I've felt
like I was running on empty... like I was Wile E. Coyote, kept
from falling only by my own inertia, held up only by my lack of
recognition that I'd had the ground yanked out from underneath
me... much like the situation of my own generation.

    We're all wandering around, carrying big dreams, big hopes,
while we scrounge for work, juggle two, three part time jobs, and
curse the obstacle course and barriers that seem to spring out of
nowhere.

    Dammit. Kurt and his music were ANGRY, FUCKED UP, CONFUSED,
full of inchoate rage, bitterness, despair... driven by intense,
slurred, blurred guitar riffs and bizarre, random lyrics. HE may
not have spoken for my generation, but he spoke for me, and a lot
of others I suspect... and his end, in a way, is quite fitting.
Ultimately, he just couldn't deal with all the pain, the stress,
the chaos and just totally freaked out and killed himself. Just
as with River Phoenix, my initial reaction was: "That stupid
fuck. Goddammit, why'd you have to go and do that, man? (Kinda
pleading bewilderment here.) Man... shit. (Anger at the absurdity
of the world.)"

    I guess, to sum it up: Kurt's music--YES, finally, something
that expresses the despair, rage and bewilderment with which I
face the world every goddamn day. Kurt's life: seen it all too
many times in my friends and aquaintaces... empathy, sorrow...
testimony to the trials and tribulations of many of us. Kurt's
death: sorrow, anger and bewilderment. And understanding.

Thomas Leavitt



ARTICLE TWO
************************************************************
INTERNATIONAL POP OVERTHROW
Jesse Garon ([e-mail])


    I'm writing these words three days after Kurt Cobain was
found in his Seattle home with a bullet in his head.  It's hard
to find the words to write about this, hard to navigate between
the cultural impact and the personal impact, partly because it's
hard to figure out how to separate them in my own mind.
    _Nevermind_ *was* like a blast of fresh air for a lot of
people, including me, when it first came out.  The lyrics to
songs like "Smells Like Teen Spirit", and the sharp riffs that
backed them up, expressed a rage that was both poetic and
incoherent.  To this day, I'm still not sure what lines like "a
mulatto / an albino / a mosquito / my libido" mean; but the way
that Cobain delivered those lines, combined with the rolling
power of the instrumentation, hit me in such a way that every
time I hear the song feels like the first -- the power does not
diminish with repitition.  But it wasn't just the way Cobain and
the other members of Nirvana played; the song itself had staying
power, because Tori Amos' solo piano version was equally
powerful, haunting where the original had felt exhilarating.
    Simply put, there was a depth to Cobain's talents and
abilities as a songwriter and a musician that will now never be
fully explored, because his personal demons, the ones that Cobain
battled in his public life (both as a performer and as a
celebrity, a figure to be examined and interviewed and critiqued)
and his private life, coalesced in an empty house and a shotgun.
He's become a part of "that stupid club" as his mother referred
to it (and in that reaction to her son's death, one might be
inclined to see hints of the strained and painful relationships
in his life), an increasing list of rock stars who die through
one form of misadventure or another.  One of the things that most
pisses me off about the immediate response to Cobain's suicide is
the number of commentators who are quick to blame the entire
affair on Cobain's heroin use; if he had never tried drugs in the
first place, the argument runs, he never would have felt the urge
to kill himself.  Which is patently stupid, and ignores the very
real and very hurt person behind the media image (as one LA
television station put it, the spokesman for the "disgruntled
twentysomethings of the so-called Generation X") that they've
been feeding to us ever since the release of _Nevermind_.  It
also typically refuses to lay any blame on the psychotic
proliferation of guns and firearms within American culture.  I
don't want to get on too much of a political sopabox here, but if
Cobain has a fight and locks himself in a room with three
pistols, a shotgun, and *twenty-five* boxes of ammunition (as he
did a few weeks before the suicide), something is seriously
fucked.  That a clearly disturbed (and I don't mean that in a
perjorative or negative way) person like Cobain was able to
purchase that kind of firepower without anybody stopping him --
or even worse, that somebody who knew him, knew what he was going
through, would buy it for him -- is ludicrous.  And still they
say he's just another junkie whose life was fucked up by the
heroin.  Fuck.
    A lot of things are spinning through my head right now.  I'm
thinking of the early rock legend Johnny Ace, who blew his brains
out backstage playing Russian roulette.  I'm thinking of that
Smiths song "Paint A Vulgar Picture", the one that begins "At the
record company meeting, on their hands a dead star" and outlines
not only the crass hoopla with which the industry treats its dead
but the emotional impact that a pop star can have on a receptive
soul, somebody who opens up their heart and mind to the message,
if there is any, in the music.  I don't want to play "Spot the
premonitions of suicide" with Cobain's lyrics -- I do know that
to a lot of people, Cobain mattered, and that's what counts.  Esa
Saarinen writes, "To be a media figure is to be the object of
uncontrolled emotions, projected on you with ridiculous self-
assurance by complete strangers," the people that Morrissey
refers to as "living in those ugly new houses".  Us.  The
ordinary people who are left behind.
    I'm thinking about Courtney Love a bit, too -- hard not to,
of course, what with all the attention given to her arrest, as
well as to the memorial tape, a document that I felt was very
moving, a raw and honest expression at the anger that she felt at
Kurt and at the world.  And while everyone else is talking about
how ironic "I swear I don't have a gun" was, I've actually got
Pearl Jam song running through my head.  Jeremy spoke in class
today.  And we all heard the report.  Just don't let half-baked
"experts" like Rachel Felder try to figure out what it meant for
you.  Have the courage and the conviction to figure it out for
yourself, and always remember how precious life is.  Don't buy
into the creed of "life fast, die young", or the myth of the rock
martyr. In the words of John Lydon, "Don't get fucked up by that
dirty rock and roll lifestyle.  It's not good for you at all."

KURT COBAIN 1967-1994


j_garon                          international pop overthrow
-------                          +++++++ Jesse Garon +++++++
@io.com                          unorthodox economic revenge



ARTICLE THREE
************************************************************
SLACKER DEMIGOD? *
Paul Tyrell ([e-mail])


    Now I have noticed a great deal of Kurt bashing, and he's an
asshole, and what he did was stupid and he had everything to live
for and he was a stain black mark period. I don't know, but it
seems there is a colossal quantity of hatred and derision stored
up in a good many people.

    Andy Rooney did his bit to spit on Kurt Cobain and, through
him, a large segment of the youth of the world. He asked 'what
good are they doing, what are they contributing to society?' And
went on to suggest we save our tears for another fellow listed in
the same obituary, who was a generation or two older, and was a
professor, and was into codebreaking in the big war, while
writing Cobain off as a worthless aside and an overall waste of
skin, to paraphrase, but not necessarily to exaggerate.

    What did Kurt Cobain do that granted him the right to live
on Earth without continual derision by those who would see him
destroyed and forgotten? He (prhaps unwittingly...) became the
spokesperson and mentor and living example that brought thousands
upon thousands of like minded people with similar troubles and
similar lifestyles together to stand at last upon some kind of
common ground. People of that strain at last had something in
common on a large scale that they could mutually agree upon,
namely the general emotive tenets of glorious grunge.

    Anti youth respectability bastions and other people who
deserve to live and eat food basically despise anything to do
with young people into grunge-like lifestyles, they believe them
to be worthless leeches with nothing better to do than take drugs
en masse and slack off, while 'contributing nothing to society.'
Now here I might say that the selfless toilings of the
generations past have paved the way for ease and comfort on the
part of those who followed. It's true. Thank you old people, my
forefathers, who took the level of land use and productivity to
huge and unprecedented heights... you have indeed generated much
wealth for human kind, and placed us on a higher plateau than at
any time in history, and in much larger numbers to boot. I will
not mention the hideious damage to the ecology of the Earth and
the belittlement of industrial age human workers that was one of
the side effects of this improvement, because that was more or
less unforseeable at the time, and it is only after the backlash
of our polution etc came back in unavoidable and noticeable form
that humanity became aware of it, and hence driven by necessity
to curtail the damage and repair it.

    That is the essence of the position of the slacker
generation, the people Kurt Cobain was loved by. The slackers
have been educated to the problems of the ecosystem of Earth, and
are left to make sense out of all the pieces. It is a frustrating
task, and it is not easy to find paying and respectable jobs
right away that reflect such a position. It is the slacker credo,
more or less, to stop digging deeper and at and back to try to
gather information that could one day be incorperated and
utilized in a constructive society. I may be speaking for more
people than I have a right to speak for, but what the hell,
grandiosity seems grandiose.

    The reason we are not, at present, visibly doing anything to
support society, is because we know that to support society in
the same way that, granted, raised the living standards of many
many humans, would pose a definite drain upon the global
ecosystem. The lifestyle that is today touted as being acceptable
and worthy of praise, (namely good old working for a living.) has
proven to be unsustainable in its present form, when practised by
so many people. It is also unecessary for everyone to be toiling
at menial tasks these days, because atomation has eliminated many
jobs, and the rapid increase in overall productivity and wealth
creating has left us with a surplus of resources. Similar to what
happens in ant hills, when there are a certain percentage of ants
who are 'slackers', and who do very little if anything, yet eat
the bounty which other ants in the colony had worked hard for,
humans seem to behave in a likewise fashion.

    Following the path of least resistance, a living being will
do as little as possible to keep itself alive. If the anthill is
displaced, or a quantity of its inhabitants killed, then the lazy
ants will begin to work. We humans on Earth are in a phase of
relative bounty at the present time, and it is not necessary for
all people to work all day all the time as soon as possible. We
are in a phase where it is finally possible, and due to pollution
and the precarious ecosystem, necessary, to stop driving in one
direction and think through possible scenarios that could lead
the world to higher, richer, and more sustainable lifestyles. The
fraction of slackers who believe it possible to turn aroun a
dying world could be said to fit this category; the waiters, and
the planners in the background.

    Some slackers are not educated to the possabilities of a
workable global ecosystem, and are of the bleak future get your
kicks now variety. Maybe they are differently educated. I count
myslelf lucky that I can be duped into believing that 'it can all
be worked out'. Whatever. I'm in no hurry.

    Now Kurt Cobain I guess figured he had nothing to live for.
I figure, because of personal biases, that he was in a
relationship with Courtney Love that was not supportive to his
masculinity, and their having a child and sealing their future in
a long term sense must have blown a hole through his optimism.
Maybe not. No offense to Courney, it's just that sometimes
relations between two people get into ruts, and it is extremely hard
to get out of them. I had this recently, thats why i mention it.
It does seem however that In Utero was predominantly concerned with
his griping about being married and having kids. He has his own pet
virus. On and on over much of the album. I figured his relationship
with Courtney was a bad one, and the Bean must have blown his mind.
No offense whatever to the Bean or the wife. Men are weak and if it
doesn't go exactly the way they like it we get annoyed and whiney.
Feminism has gone too far to the extreme, and they resent far too
much the stereotypical male behaviour, in fact I can safely say
that hardcore feminists embody in their hatred and harshness all
those male traits they are fighting to destroy. Calm down, even
ground. We are sorry for a few thousand years of subservience,
ladies, but the big black book just seemed so important at the
time. Its all over now, for the most part, thanks in part to your
rebellion. Now stop rebelling and be friends, huh? I am no big deal.
Male power is addictive. I love it, but I will not use it to belittle
or subjugate females, trust me. Kurt I think had made a similar
commitment.

    O.K, no brilliant conclusions, but Kurt was a good man, and
he made the best of his troubles for as long as he could. It is
sad he did not find any solutions, exept the one. The biggie.
Sarcastically judging from the shitty reaction of many people
towards Kurt, post mortem, I would say that according to them his
self sacrifice was the right thing to do, you know, leaving the
world for the good people, the contributors. I can look thousands
of people in the eye these days, partly because Kurt Cobain sung
so succinctly of the life so many of us lead. I am in love with
the crowd, and I thank Kurt for drawing that crowd together in
the first place.



ARTICLE FOUR
************************************************************
JESU KURTE *
Ritchie Eppink <[e-mail]>

Kurdt died for our sins.
...john, ian, janis....no
Kurdt was a Jesus in the way he saw the world and in the way he
decided
to leave.

I am far from being a theological expert on much, yet I know that
Christianity affirms that Jesus was sent to show the world it
wrong.

Now, certainly Kurdt is far from divine and was probably not sent
by anyone, but he has managed to show the world its problems up
to his death.

Jesus was a revolutionary that led nothing.  Jesus played on the
feeling of revolution that was in the Israeli air -- he used the
desire to change as his medium to speak to the people.  Shailer
Mathews said of Jesus, "without leading a revolt, he was to live
and teach in the atmosphere of revolution, use the language of
revolution, make the revolutionary spirit the instrument of his
message, and organize a movement composed of men who awaited a
divinely given new age."

Kurdt was the same.  Kurdt did not, nor did he desire to, lead
anybody in any movement whatsoever.  Kurdt's music was barely
commentary, it was, in fact, simply his semi-personal thoughts
put on display.  It seems to me that his power-chord anger and
repeated, unintelligible lyrics were as close to real anger as
music can come.  Hardcore cleans up their music, blasting in
short packets of hate;  and angry glam-pop is no deeper than its
lyrics.  Because Kurdt saw little importance in actually _caring_
what the music portrayed, he managed to portray his ideas more
efficiently than anyone had in the past.

This was the "atmosphere of revolution" that Kurdt utilized to
"change the world".  Anger.  Nirvana was popular because people
could use it to hate very easily.  Few people I know can avoid
sneering and screaming when they hear the likes of "Paper Cuts",
"Beeswax", or "Smells Like Teen Spirit".  Many people, including
myself, had wandered around for years inherently despising a lot
of things, but only "hated" when it didn't matter.  Then, all of
the sudden, Kurdt displays his anger and speckled past for the
Top-40 world and all these people find a saviour.

Kurdt was also like Jesus in his death.  True Christians do good
things because Jesus died for them.  Jesus pointed out the
problems by dying. I don't think Kurdt was making a social
commentary through his suicide, but I think that he said
something indirectly.  He showed America that the American dream
is wrong, that success is far from being important.  Kurdt rose
out of a lower-class, Aberdeen, Wa. family to become a
millionaire with a new house in Seattle.  Kurdt was to guitar-
playing teenagers what Michael Jordan is to the children on
Harlem basketball courts.  But then he showed his emulators how
dreadfully twisted the world is.  His life was filled with pain
throughout, but he wasn't really sick of it until he had the
money and fame to cope with it.  Kurdt died with his middle
finger up towards success and corporate perversion.  And as much
as people will want to avoid it, Kurdt is proof that the American
dream is fucked.

No, Kurdt is not divine, or sent to do the world a favor.  He
didn't think so, and had no intentions of looking so.
Nonetheless, he did a lot for people with his music, and, though
many fans don't think so now, did a lot for them by putting a
shotgun to his idolized head.

I hope this pissed you off...

"Gotta find a way, a better way"

JEZMUND, TFB
[e-mail]



ARTICLE FIVE
************************************************************
WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE? *
John Kelin ([e-mail])


    What can you say about a 27 year old man who destroys
himself? Especially when  he's wealthy, and successful in his
chosen field?
    I sure as hell don't know.
    A young guy with a promising future and recent mega-success
blows his head off with a shotgun. It is a great tragedy--not so
much to the "music world," whatevert that is, but to the real
world, where lives can become so knotted up that self-destruction
seems to be a viable option.
    Many have been highly critical of what Kurt Cobain did, with
the old *permanent solution to a temporary problem* argument
trotted out on cue. It's hard to counter that position. The great
cruelty of suicide is always that the one who kills himself is
irrevokably gone--but many more helpless victims are left behind.
As much as I wish he hadn't done it, though, I refuse to fault
Kurt Cobain for bumping himself.
    Shortly after his body was discovered on April 8, I checked
the alt.music.nirvana newsgroup. And i must confess to being
surprised at the level of hostility in some of the postings.

>>All he had to do was retire a rich man at age 27, instead of a
poor corpse at age 27. Suicide is such a loser way out.<<

    This was not an uncommon sentiment, in the days immediately
following Cobain's death. Among other things, he was reviled as
an "acid dropping, drug-taking, wife-beating asshole;" another
posting said, "At least he went out with a BANG." This, to me,
was almost as troubling as the suicide itself. How could any
presumed fan spit on Cobain's corpose before it was even cold?

>>I don't think he's gonna be anything like a "Jim Morrison of
the 90s" as I've heard some say already. In a few months, a year
at most, this'll die down.<<

    When people identify strongly with an artist's work, they
sometimes forget that it is only through the work that they know
that artist. The truth is that no one can know what was really going
on inside Kurt Cobain's head. No one can know the pressures
he was subjected to after being catapulted by the media into the
position of Generation X leading light. No one can really know
the extent of the damage done to him during his childhood, or the
lingering effects it had on his adulthood.
    But from the available evidence, it must have been pretty
bad.
    This is one of the really troubling aspects of the entire
incident, as far as I'm concerned--the pschological baggage that
Kurt Cobain was obviously carrying around. His widow made
reference to the "Cobain Curse," meaning that Cobain men tend to
kill themselves when the going gets rough. In support of this she
pointed to three of his uncles who also did the ultimate deed.
    While I tend to view Cobain's suicide with compassion, news
of this so-called curse has really infuriated me. I most
definitely do not believe in curses, family or otherwise. But I
DO believe in self-fulfilling prophecies, and the suggestion that
Kurt Cobain was allowed to grow up believing that suicide might
well be his destiny is something that I find appalling. It is the
only truly unforgivable aspect of the whole sordid affair.

>>Sorry, Kurt. Wish we could have helped you.<<

    And kept you from joining that stupid club.



ARTICLE SIX
************************************************************
SONG AND VOICE *
Eu-Ming Lee ([e-mail])--I like getting email.

"I want to eat your cancer when you turn back."

How's this for bitterness:

I got a copy of a .WAV file with Courtney reading/sobbing through
excerpts of Kurt's suicide letter at the vigil.  I'll remix it
into a punk/grunge anger song called, "This Song's So Tragic, You
Can Dance to It."

I don't want money
I don't want fame
I just wanna go
Like Kurt Cobain.

Let's just dance
and have some fun
Then end our lives
with a big shotgun.

Take these pills
Drink champagne
I just wanna go
Like Kurt Cobain.

When theey find me
I'll be dead.
I want my fans
to eat my head

I bought a shotgun
To blow out my brains
I'm gonna go
Like Kurt Cobain

This thing called life
Ain't so tragic
When I'm dead
You can dance to it.

AND

I've heard some comparisons between the sudden deaths of Kurt
Cobain and John Lennon and what that means to each of the
respective generations.

Lennon was the voice of his generation.  His was a voice of
optimism, love, and spiritual fullness.  He struggled against an
obvious enemy--a government at war with a political ideal, and
sometimes, with their own people.  When  that voice was silenced
in 1981, those struggles had already been resolved.  In fact, the
generation itself had emerged as the same establishment it had
once fought.  The loss of Lennon heralded the decade of greed--
How ironic that a generation which protested a war over ideology
would later promote a war over crude oil interests.

Cobain, although arguably not popular enough to be called the
voice of his generation, was certainly a true voice for many
people.  His voice echoed the sentiments of despair,
disillusionment, confusion, and spiritual emptiness among his
many fans.  And like the fans of Lennon, the fans of Cobain
fought with him against a common enemy.  This enemy was far more
insidious and persistent than Lennon's enemy.  This enemy was the
self.

The difference between Lennon and Cobain is that Lennon won his
struggle, and Cobain lost his.  While Lennon's generation was
empowered by their victory over the government, Cobain's
generation can only be further disillusioned, confused, and
withdrawn by the loss of the voice of their leader.  Those who
ask, "Where were his friends?  What about his daughter? His wife?
His fans?  His music?  His talent?  His money?" forget Cobain's
basic struggle.  Cobain struggled against himself, against his
own pain, against his very existence.  And at the pinnacle of his
success, he must have realized that the very thing he struggled
against had become larger than he could possibly manage.  He was
Kurt Cobain, front man for Nirvana, pioneer of the Seattle sound,
a cash cow for the major label he signed to. His success and
public prominence loomed larger than the ten year old Kurt, the
one whose parents divorced, the one who was bounced from relative
to relative, the one whose stomach trouble brought drug problems,
the one who was mocked for pursuing painting.  Those issues were
never resolved for Cobain.  And in the end, the Goliath of his
success consumed the humble gentle man which was Kurt himself.

I mourn for Kurt Cobain because he was a man who fought his
battle well.  He pursued his passions, his dreams, and his love
with vigor and integrity.  He attained success in so many ways
which most of us can never know.  Yet, none of those things-- his
wife, his daughter, his music, his passion-- were enough to
conquer the demons which haunted him.  Some of you say, "If _I_
had a wife; if _I_ had a daughter; if _I_ had success; if _I_ had
such love; if _I_ had such passion; then I would be happy, then I
would never kill myself."  Perhaps at one point, Kurt said those
very words.  And after pursuing happiness and all that life could
offer with far more vigor, intensity, and success than millions
of others, he STILL was miserable, he STILL could not live with
himself.  I respect him for trying, and I love him for sharing
his struggles with us.  I shall remember him for how he lived, to
the fullest and without reservation, with kindness and humility.
That he lost his struggle is of no consequence.  He fought an
epic battle, and will still be my hero

Ming
of the self-titled twenty-whatever generation.
ARTICLE SEVEN
*****************************************************************
KURT COBAIN TRIBUTE
Mik Stevens <[e-mail]>



Kurt Cobain  1967 -  1994
-------------------------


    There will always be something sad, pathetic and wasteful
associated with the premature demise of Kurt Cobain.  The paradox
that he created within his own life eventually drove him to end
it.  His disillusionment with the fame and success that he
brought upon himself, married with his desire to carry on being
rich and famous.  His fear of failure and his suicide note
containing his regrets at "faking" his performances.  These are
just small insights into his confused state of mind when he chose
to take his own life.

    As a unwitting cross bearer for countless other deluded
twenty-somethings Cobain lost touch with the fans who he really
tried to bring his message to.  As the army of Nirvana fans
increased, not just those who understood his post punk anguish,
but those who would just jump on any hyped bandwagon.  Kurt saw
the people he hated attending his gigs, he saw that the crown of
poularity being placed on his head.  He equally felt
uncomfortable with both.  He felt that he was cheating himself,
and cheating himself was far more important than cheating his
fans.

    His drug problems, argumants with Courtney and his medical
problems also will have had some bearing on the way he felt
during his final days.

Why did Nirvana do things that other bands couldn't.  Kurt was so
messed inside, so concerned with the "being", he brought another
dimension to the Angst filled punk music of the previous decades.
He looked inside whilst so many other messages of today reflect
what is going on outside. This self study resulted directly from
the self doubt and his loner nature. Nirvana's music though broke
down some of the barriers that many others felt.  The message was
in the music, not that "someone cares" or, "everything will be
alright", but there are others who know how YOU feel, there are
others who understand what is going on.

    The music produced was violent, but restrained, tortured,
but hopeful, and always seemed to be teetering on the edge of
falling into the abyss.  This living on the edge feel is just
exactly how Kurt felt.

    It'll never been understood the exact reasons why Kurt
didn't feel he could continue.  Many people have expressed that
with his money he could run from the fame and never work again,
that he could afford anything.  I think that Kurt was just as
addicted to the pain of his fame as he was to the drugs he used
to escape his own physical pain.  He couldn't have quit no matter
how hard he tried.  His anguish must have been great.  This was
the second attempt he had made on his own life (the first being
his 60 pill and Champagne binge in Italy that put him in a coma
only weeks before).  To leave his daughter to face the rest of
her life alone, to leave his fans who had heard his message the
stark realities of his depression = death.  For these things he
cannot be forgiven.

    His only mitigation is that he had written and told everyone
what was going to happen.   His tortured music, lyrics,
interviews and lifestyle all point to self destruction.   That
no-one was able to help him is a refelction on everyone who ever
heard his message.  Suicide was going to be the only way, as
always, he was looking inside and didn't wish to lose control.



PEACE. LOVE. EMPATHY.


mik


* indicates editor's title, just fyi

//END ARTICLES SUBMITTED THROUGH E-MAIL; BEGIN NET-CAPTURES

From: [e-mail] (Neil P. Kelly)
Newsgroups: alt.music.nirvana
Subject: MTV's uses for Kurt's body.
Date: 9 Apr 1994 23:26:33 GMT

1. Judge in Lip Service.
2. Stick him next to Howard on Jon Stewart.
3. Guest on Jon Stewart.
4. Hang him from the rafters on MTV JAMS.
5. Cameraman for the Real World.
6. Real World in Seattle, with the guy from Mother Love Bone.
7. huh-huh, huh-huh.
8. Kurt Loder's co-anchor. (Hell, he'll offer more insight than
   Tabitha Soren.)
9. Replacement for Cindy on House Of Style.
10. Red Johnny and the Dead Guy.

Seriously, if he had been found today (Saturday) do you think
they would have gone with the Nirvanathon or Spring Break
repeats?

Why the Nirvana tribute...only one's dead (so far).
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-Neil Kelly                                   [e-mail]



From: [e-mail] (MAC)
Subject: Proposal: Kurt Cobain fan group
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 94 15:15:18 GMT

In article <2o8a2i$[e-mail]>,
Tim Pierce <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In article <2o7uq2$[e-mail]>
>Dave Sill <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>Nope, I issued the newgroup (from another system) after I'd
seen at least half a dozen different people request it.
>I must compliment you on your extraordinary timing, Dave.
>Perhaps you're right -- I should pipe down and listen to you
>a little more often, since you seem to have this alt thing
>honed to a fine science.
>

Yes it seems that in this case he was right on.
However, I am now opening up the discussion period for:

alt.fan.kurt-cobain.dead.dead.dead

or

alt.fan.kurt-cobain.bang.bang.bang


I am kinda leaning toward the second.  Discuss.

MAC


ELEGY
From: [e-mail] (James Dixon)
Subject: Elegy for Kurt
Date: 8 Apr 1994 19:53:52 GMT

"Elegy for Kurt"

His funeral is like your own cellular centralizer,
  it buzzes softly.
    Kurt Cobain longs for his delectable originality that he
    cradles.
    Kurt Cobain worries for his vagina.
      Their evangelical beagle gives to creepy Courtney Love.
        My bliss kisses



           affably if immediately.
    Kurt Cobain despairs.



From: [e-mail] (Don Frega)
Subject: Elegy for Kurt
Date: 11 Apr 1994 18:28:26 GMT

His funeral is like your own cellular centralizer,
   it buzzes softly…
    Kurt Cobain longs for his delectable originality that he
cradles.
    Kurt Cobain worries for his vagina.
  Their evangelical beagle gives to creepy Courtney Love.
     My bliss kisses affably if immediately.
     Kurt Cobain despairs.

Pantheisms will be nonconformist furies!
     Must his cantankerous espresso give things to the familial
ambition?
    His cloud suffers for his rock,
   More than one contemporary conviction receives from Frances
Bean.
     Their elves show something to too few agonies.
     Would you pay 52 dollars to get used to his creepy
allegorical rock?

My philosophers extract from her
     an ephemeral belligerence is
               an authority.
Kurt Cobain hopes for Hell-
   his pigheaded flow is his plastic causation.
  try to refuse,
   to anatomize with ease,

    With Stones,
   Kurt Cobain sees.

A fear is a context.
      His concept
   with despair.

     Most measures want things from Eddie Vedder;
     do not receive from falls.
     This extracurricular antagonism is like innumerable asylums.

Kurt Cobain disappears loudly, angrily.



From: [e-mail] (Hofman Karen)
Subject: the last humming of the doomed.
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 23:50:33 GMT

The "in Utero" album was officialy to be released "I HATE MYSELF
and WANT to DIE.".

what made him do it ?
He had a family and was a success blah, blah, blah. Well I can
tell you that he probably got sick of this sick and festering
disease of a world we live in. His death might not achieve too
much, but it is an act that represents well our generation. It is
not an advocation for suicide but more like a sign of our time.
It's sad when we see an icon of our generation go like this. Its
sadder to think that this was his last statement to the world:
one of hopelessness. It's up to us to not let it go unnoticed.

Peter


From: [e-mail] (Margo George)
Subject: Re: the last humming of the doomed.
Date: 9 Apr 1994 05:30:55 GMT

"Busted Flat In Baton Rouge, Waitin' for A Train
Feelin' Near as faded as my jeans

Bobbie Thumbed a diesel down, just before it rained
We took it all the way to New Orleans...

Freedom's just another word  for 'nothin' left to lose
Nothin' it ain't nothin' hon, if it ain't free
Well, feelin' good was easy lord, when he sang the blues,
Feelin' good was good enough for me

Good enough for me and my Bobbie McGee"

So 20 years plus ago, the question was, why did Janice let it
happen

Its the same principle, ain't it?  What freaks, me is I've been
singing this song for like a week, and Curt's been dead now a
week, and we didn't even know it... Why WHY WHY.  I grew up
there, I'm older, I have less to give up he had so WHY DID HE  DO
IT?

[e-mail]


From: [e-mail] (Jeff Beall)
Subject: News Announcement
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 01:03:19 GMT

NIRVANA SINGER KURT COBAIN DEAD

    SEATTLE (Reuter) - Kurt Cobain, the troubled leader of one
of the world's more popular rock bands Nirvana, has died, his
management said Friday, and the cause appeared to be suicide.
    Cobain, 27, was found by an electrician earlier Friday as he
was doing repairs on the singer's Seattle home. A gun and a
suicide note were near the body, Seattle police said.
    Cobain had been resting at home since recovering from a
drug-induced coma in Rome last month. He has kept guns in the
house from time to time.
    ``We are deeply saddened by the loss of such a telented
artist, close friend, loving husband and father," his management,
Gold Mountain Entertainment, said.
    ``The intensity and creativity of Kurt's musics and his
thoughts will always be treasured. Kurt's music has transcended
beyond the popular to speak to millions around the world.
    ``Painfully Kurt's passions and feelings about his fame
overwhelmed him. We will miss him, his music, and his friendship
deeply."
    With their punk-influenced music and angst-ridden lyrics,
Nirvana were by far the most successful of Seattle's ``grunge"
rock bands. His death is one of the biggest tragedies to hit the
rock world.


Transmitted:  94-04-08 16:59:00 EDT

-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Every word is like an unnecessary stain on silence &
nothingness."
Samuel Beckett
[e-mail]--------------------------


From: [e-mail] (Shahed Amanullah)
Subject: Post Mortem
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 01:39:56 GMT



Geez, this newsgroup is hardly a week old.  There's no justice in
this world.

Kurt soaked up the pain for a whole generation.  I hurt a little
bit more now that he's gone.  I guess it was just inevitable.

Goodbye, Kurt.  Say hello to Frances Farmer for me.

=================================================================
shahed amanullah                             see the happy moron!
san francisco, california                 he doesn't give a damn!
[e-mail]                          i wish i were a moron!
phone [phone]                         (my God! perhaps i am)
=================================================================


FRONT PORCH
From: [e-mail] (John Frost)
Subject: Lyrics for Kurt
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 02:23:17 GMT


Someone said that to martyr the man was wrong. To savor the
lyrics of his songs was to celebrate the man who abused his body
with drugs and who fought with his wife and who was not a
republican and didn't sing christian hymms.

(well maybe he didn't say all that, but the trend was there)

I got mad, I got depressed, I got sentimental. And when I get
sentimental I get artsy. So failing to make anything out of my
High School singing career I am writing these lyrics in hopes
that Somewhere Kurt is listening and understanding a whole lot
better today, then he did when he plugged himself full of lead.

-Front Porch-
by John Frost

On the Front Porch of the house
There is a depression
Which the water fills in the rain

each time I must go outside
To sweep away the pain
before that depression becomes a stain

    And when I'm done
        it rains again

And in the summer
In the Hot and dry
I go outside to be the sky

Then High in the sky
the thunder clouds arrive
A flashflood in my mind

    And when I'm down
        It rains again

    So he is fallen
    So he is gone
    So the world is not undone

    So the rain
    So the sun
    So the sky is all come down

    And when he's gone
        It rains again.

1994

Kurt Cobain 1967-1994



From: [e-mail] (L. Ruppenthal)
Subject: Death can be ok too...
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 08:30:28 GMT

    Although I'm curious as to why he did it, I realize that
it's been done.  Why is this all seen as such a horrific thing?
It's sort of beautiful in a way.  Think about it ...

    He lived a life, relatively short, but oh what a life.  He
had lots of pain, seemed to have some happiness and he
experienced a lot, and gave so much more for others to
experience.

    But he chose to die ... and so what?  Life is definitely
full of experiences, good and bad.  Death is the final
experience.  Consider that maybe Cobain was finally ready for
death, maybe he just wanted to call it a day and shuffle off this
mortal coil.  Yes, it's sad to those he left behind - his family,
friends and fans.  They will miss him and remember him.  But we
should only be sad to a point.  Consider the happiness that is
involved.  You must remember this:  Kurt WANTED to die.  I will
not be against such a wish - I can only respect the grace and
nobility of wishing to fulfill one's own destiny.

    There can be no doubt as to the week (or perhaps years) of
hell prior to this final decision.  But a decision was made -
most importantly, a PERSONAL decision.  And who knows where he is
now?  Perhaps he discovered the elusive nirvanna at last, perhaps
he resides in limbo, maybe even Dante's basement.  But whichever
it is, he's there now - and he chose the path himself.  Respect
that.  Make sure not to forget, but most importantly, be happy!

    All I do know is this:  I'm glad to have had the opportunity
to love this man, hate him and be indifferent to him - all at the
same time.

    Perhaps death is sweeter than it seems ...

Leo

--Have fun Kurt, you worked hard for it.


--> L.D. Ruppenthal            <[e-mail]>
--> McMaster University        (905) 574+5545
-->
--> Why do you still haunt me?



From: [e-mail] (Scott Garrison)
Subject: Re: L8R, Kurt....
Date: Sat, 09 Apr 1994 17:04

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Heather Cross) writes:

>"I'm not like them, I can pretend.......I think I'm dumb, maybe
just happy."
>
>How I wish that would have been the case.
>
>My Dad, who is 46 yrs. old, heard the news and told me it
>reminded him of when John Lennon was shot--he told me, "It's the
>same feeling of 'It's getting to the point where I don't want to
>listen to music anymore'; I feel like something like this always
>happens to the ones I like."
>
>I'm just glad Kurt didn't kill himself 8 years ago--I'm glad we
>got to hear what we did.
>
>Nirvana was Kurt, in a lot of ways, and I will always respect
>the man who breathed life back into Rock and Roll.
>
>I'm saddened that he felt that he had no other options.....
>and he left one person a widow and another person fatherless.
>
>
>Kurt, we hardly knew ya...
>thanks for staying as long as you did.
>
>and thanks for the music...
>
>
>Heather
>
>"We'll float around, hang out on clouds..."
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------
> Heather Cross
> [e-mail]
>----------------------------------------------------------------

Right on, Heather.  This is the best of the lot that I've scanned
on this newsgroup since yesterday.  Thanks for articulating in
concise and simple terms the idea that we were lucky to have Kurt
Cobain's music as long as we did.  Personally, I'm sorry he's
gone, but I'm also interested in seeing what Novoselic and Grohl
do next with whatever projects they'll start next.
With respect,

SG



BOWIE
From: [e-mail] (Heather Cross)
Subject: One last thing......
Date: Sat, 09 Apr 94 19:50:57 EDT

"Rock'n'Roll Suicide" by David Bowie

Time takes a cigarette
Puts it in your mouth
You pull on your finger, then another finger,
Then your cigarette.
The wall-to-wall is calling...
It lingers, then you forget
You're a Rock'n'Roll Suicide

You're too old to lose it..
Too young to choose it
And the clock waits so patiently on your song.
You walk past the cafe..
But you don't eat when you've lived too long
You're a Rock'n'Roll suicide.

Chev brakes are snarling, as you stumble across the road
But the day breaks instead so you hurry home.
Don't let the sun blast your shadow
Don't let the milk floats ride your mind
So natural....religiously unkind

Oh no love! You're not alone
You're watching yourself, but you're too unfair
You got your head all tangled up,
But if I could only make you care
Oh no love, you're not alone
No matter what or who you've been
No matter when or where you're seen
All the knives seem to lacerate your brain
I've had my share; I'll help you with the pain

You're not alone... just turn on with me.
You're not alone... let's turn on and be
You're not alone... gimme your hands.
You're wonderful... gimme your hands.

-from _Ziggy Stardust_



From: [e-mail] (SEAN JAFFEE ROHDE)
Subject: Re: sucks it's true
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 00:49:26 GMT

it's kind of wierd having him dead now. i used to find myself
wondering what he'll be doing 25 years from now. nothing now i
guess. it was a stupid thing to do. i don't respect him for it,
but i don't blame him for it. he was pretty screwed up before,
and had lots of problems. to bad he couldn't deal with life like
mark arm does. he just does his musicdoes his own thing, and
ignores the rest. everybody's different though. he has definitely
places himself in legend land. instead of fading away, he cut
himself off at the peak of his career. i feel sorry for his kid.
i'm glad i made it my hobbie of the past 4 years to collect
nirvana bootlegs. he gave me that. or something. this news thing
is confusing. sad. owell.




Subject: Rest In Peace Kurt Cobain
From: [e-mail]
Date: 9 Apr 94 20:43:23 EDT

Summer of 1991 - I went to London for the summer. Nirvana were
playing the Reading Festival, and since Bleach (esp. School) was
a record I really loved I though it would be really cool to see
them. Nirvana played the afternoon scene, with the "small" bands.
Before Dinosuar Jr., and way before Sonic Youth and headliner
Iggy Pop. At the end of the show Kurt did that jump into the
drums now documanted in the Lithium video. No wonder he was with
a cast on his arm for the rest of the festival. One song they did
was "Teen Spirit" - but who expected that to be played every 5
minutes on MTV? So when coming home I discovered Teen Spirit soon
became a hit, the rest of the summer of 1991 was all about
Nirvana... Coming, a year later, to a new school in a new
country, I turned my TV on as I entered my new dorm room. MTV
played Lithium. I was relaxed. If Nirvana are the first thing I
see here, things can't be that strange or difficult. Now he's
gone. For our generation - he will always symbolize something.
For being the first popular star of punk rock, for sharing our
angst at the fact that there's "no recess" (School). For making
great music.

Aeyal Gross




From: [e-mail] (Hofman Karen)
Subject: The last Humming of the Doomed.part 2
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 20:41:23 GMT
Lines: 24


The ultimate statement of the 90's ?
Maybe not.

BUt it is a sign. A sign that some of us here are tired of this
festering pissed-off, dog-eat-dog masturbation of a world. A sign
that some of us are about to give up. A easy way out ? maybe. But
there is a something to get out of this. money, wealth and
success is obsolete.it is not because of that that the world is
suddenly beautiful. Maybe it will start a thread, who knows ? I
see it already. fifteen year old's blowin'their head all around
the world as a form of protest. stupid ? absolutely, but it goes
for quite a statement. When a man on the top of his hill take his
life like this I think it's time to look around. I think it's
time to take a hard look at this society. I also think its time
to get up and do something. before someone YOU know do the same.

Peter

I have seen to many of my friends go that way (or others) that it
is hard for me to sit here and ignore it all.there is a similar
disease to all those death,and it's time to cure it.



From: [e-mail] (Markmeister)
Subject: Kurt Cobain: Thoughts
Date: 11 Apr 94 12:53:47 GMT

Well, over here on the East Coast, it's still taking a while to
sink in.....

I don't understand why this is a joke to some people.  Suicide
never is a joke.  What happened to K. Cobain was sad, yes, but it
should NEVER be the butt of someone's joke.  Neither should all
of this speculation about why he did what he did.  And all this
shit about "Hey, next it's Eddie Vedder"--Come on!!  Are we that
stupid and insensitive?

Another great artist gone before his time.  More color gone from
the world.

M. Mckenzie
St. Peter's College


DETAILS
From: [e-mail] (Scott H. Magoon)
Subject: Article in Details magazine
Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 12:25:48 GMT

I have the November 1993 issue of Details magazine here with an
article on Nirvana.  In it Kurt talks about the chronic stomach
problems that he says caused him to start using heroin.  I want
to quote one paragraph on that subject:

   "Imagine the worst stomach flu you've ever had, every single
day.  And it was worse when I ate, because once the meal would
touch that red area I would hyperventilate, my arms would turn
numb, and I would vomit.  I was suicidal on our last tour - I
really wanted to blow my head off.  And so when we got home I
decided to do heroin every day because obviously a heavy narcotic
is going to stop the pain.  The whole time I was doing drugs I
didn't have stomach problems."

Kurt ends the article with these thoughts:

   "I'm looking forward to a few more years of playing with this
band. Then a few years later I might say a few years more.  I
don't try to predict the future, but I know I'm not going to be
rich for the rest of my life.  I have money now, but within ten
years we'll blow it.  I'll have to get a job or have a solo
career or something equally embarrassing."

Goodbye, Kurt.


KURT AND GAYS
From: [e-mail] (Jamshid Afshar)
Subject: Re: Kurt and Michael Stipe
Date: 13 Apr 1994 04:03:03 -0500

In article <[e-mail]>,
Andrea Norstad <[e-mail]> wrote:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (sam
brown) wrote:
>> i know michael stipe was gay, maybe they were lovers and he
couldnt face reality of coming out .. j/k [j/k = joke, editor]
>
>I might be missing something that everyone else in the world
knows, but I never knew Michael Stipe is gay. Where did you hear
this?

I'm not sure that Michael Stipe is gay, and I know he hasn't come
out publicly.  Michael Musto, the Village Voice gossip columnist,
ran a blind rumor column a couple of years ago where he said
something to the effect "what singer for that newly commercial
rock band says he's not gay but doth protest too much...?".  At
the time (maybe based on some other hints) I remember thinking,
oh, that's gotta be Michael Stipe, and it's stuck in my mind ever
since.

Anyway, back to Kurt, I doubt he was gay, though he was always
pretty outspoken about gay rights.  I remember reading in an
article right after teen spirit broke that "the lead singer" had
a minor criminal record for spray-painting "homosex rules" on a
bridge somewhere.  I also read in the Voice that when Nirvana
first went on Sat. Night Live, the producers censored, or the
cameras just didn't catch, a small makeout session between Kurt
and Krist (the bassist) right before their set.  And didn't they
do some early MTV appearance in pretty summer frocks (*long*
before James)?  Finally, I've read that Cobain claimed in an
_Advocate_ interview that if it wasn't for Courtney he'd be a
practicing bisexual.  That clinches it for me -- too cool to be
closeted.  If he really wanted to have sex with a man I'm sure he
had every chance to, but apparently never took anyone up
on it (so to speak).

Kurt's NYT obit even mentioned his pro-gay stance: "Mr. Cobain
has said that he always sympathized with homosexuals and felt
trapped in the male culture of Aberdeen [his hometown].  He said
that, as a teenager, he often felt that young men had no choice
but to play sports and eventually work as loggers in the lumber
mills".  I also liked the acknowledgement that "When the grunge
look became a fashion rage, ending up in K-mart, Mr. Cobain took
note of the irony that that is where the look started".

Anyway, I was deeply saddened by Cobain's death.  I was looking
forward to at least one more good Nirvana album and was really
curious what Cobain would do next.  Okay, so I didn't buy Bleach
before Nevermind, but their lyrics move me like only a few others
do (eg, Bob Mould's).  *And* In Utero is one of the reasons I'm
saving up for better speakers.

I've always respected Nirvana because they seemed intelligent and
very self aware.  I never got the feeling that Cobain was trying
to do anything but antagonize his promoters, and he certianly
didn't seem to be *trying* to attract millions of fans.  He was
honest with his image, never pretending to be indifferent to his
success or bullshitting about how much he hates it, like that
lead singer of another band that unfortunately gets lumped with
Nirvana.  Obviously, Cobain's "whining" was very heartfelt.

An important point was raised in another thread about Cobain
becoming a member of "that stupid club".  We must remember that
he didn't die of an overdose, passed out and choking on his own
vomit.  He got a gun, pointed it to his head and pulled the
trigger.  No, I don't think that makes him any more an artist,
and claims of cowardness or stupidity are not unfounded.  But, I
think it's important to remember how he died before lumping
Cobain with all the other dead musicians who died from too much
"partying".

I don't know what pisses me off more, the fact that a bunch of
assholes like Nirvana (dude, they rock) or the fact that even
bigger assholes despised Nirvana and are now ridiculing the
tragedy because "Nirvana hasn't been cool since Bleach".  I
remember reading a few weeks ago that Cobain was harassed by some
sarcastic assholes at a club: "wow, aren't you like in the B-
52's..."?  What fuckers.  How dare these brats play cooler-than-
thou because Nirvana happened to have a couple of very popular,
radio-friendly songs.  Those assholes, even if they did have nose
rings, were probably conservative, close-minded, provincial
idiots getting ready to attend daddy's alma mater next fall.
Their most radical act in life will be getting drunk and pissing
off a balcony.  Twenty years from now they'll be fighting with
their children about haircuts and curfews (continuing the cycle).
Those assholes have no right to accuse anyone of mediocrity or
selling out.

I'll leave you with something that explains, at least to myself,
why I've always liked Nirvana and especially Cobain beyond their
musical talent.  It's apparently(?) a quote from a book or
article, posted recently by Sylvia <[e-mail]> in message
<[e-mail]> in soc.motss.

----begin quote----

    But hanging out with an openly gay friend was a little more
risky than Kurt had anticipated. Soon, says, Kurt, "I started to
realize that people were looking at me even more peculiarly than
usual". He started to get harassed. It always seemed to happen in
PE class. After everybody got dressed, somebody would inevitably
call Kurt a faggot and push him up against a locker. "They felt
threatened because they were naked and I was supposedly gay,"
says Kurt. "So they either better cover up their penises or punch
me. Or both."

    Life in high school just got harder for Kurt. Often, jocks
would chase him on the way home from school.  Sometimes they
caught him. "Every day after school," says Kurt, "this one kid
would hold me down in the snow and sit on my head."

    "After that", says Kurt, "I started being proud of the fact
that I was gay even though I wasn't. I really enjoyed the
conflict. It was pretty exciting, because I almost found my
identity. I was a _special_ geek. I wasn't quite the punk rocker
I was looking for, but at least it was better than being the
_average_ geek."

----end quote----

Jamshid Afshar
[e-mail]


KURT AS PERFORMANCE ARTIST
From: [e-mail] ()
Subject: cobain was a performance artist
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 03:10:34 GMT


Kurt Cobain was a performance artist.

He was fundamentally aware of the absurdity of his position as a
cultural icon.  He both had iconic status and at the same time
was making his viewers aware of the absurdity of that status.

In the end he did the ultimate performance, he sealed his fate as
the next in a series of dead pop stars, the stupid pop star club,
as his mother referred to.  Perhaps he believed so much in his
own iconic status that he wanted to seal it with his death and
thus follow in the line of Jim Morrison, Jimi Hendrix, Janis
Joplin, Buddy Holly, Elvis and James Dean. There is nothing like
a dead pop star in America.

I don't really know what was in Kurt Cobain's mind, it is just so
American, it was so predictable.  It was like a movie or a pop
song, just perfect for the packaging.  MTV was ready and roaring
to make money off of his death so they dedicated the entire
weekend to him and dubbed him St. Cobain while they were racking
in the bucks.  It is all so pop.

A performance artist is an individual who tinkers with our
perceptions of indevidual and of meaning, who alters the rules
and redefines them and yet is always aware of them, ultimately
making us aware of their inherent absurdity.  To this end I argue
that Cobain was a performance artist.

Still, I really did like their music. There was something
original in it.

Chris Lugo
[e-mail]

I was walking around the cemetery and the grass over the grave
parts of the cemetery was thicker and greener.


LESTER BANGS ON PETER LAUGHNER
From: [e-mail] (Bob Beck)
Subject: Kurt, Peter, Lester
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 05:22:56 GMT

"If I let myself get started I will only begin to rant and
threaten those who glamorize death, but there is a death in the
balance and you better look long and hard at it you stupid
fuckheads, you who treat life as a camp joke, you who have lost
your sense of wonder about the state of being alive itself...

"...Realizing life is precious the natural tendency is to trample
on it, like laughing at a funeral. But there are voluntary
reactions. I volunteer not to feel anything about him from this
day out, but I will not forget that this kid killed himself for
something torn T-shirts represented in the battle fires of his
ripped emotions, and that does not make your T-shirts profound,
on the contrary, it makes you a bunch of assholes if you espouse
what he latched onto in support of his long death agony, and if I
have run out of feeling for the dead I can also truly say that
from here on out I am only interested in true feeling, and the
pursuit of some ultimate escape from that was what killed Peter,
which is all I truly know of his life, except that the hardest
thing in this living world is to confront your own pain and go
through it, but somehow life is not a paltry thing after all next
to this child's inheritance of eternal black. So don't anybody
try to wave good-bye."

    -- Lester Bangs, "Peter Laughner," 1977

bob beck    [e-mail]


INSIDERS ACCOUNT
ben reitman ([e-mail]) wrote:
: i'm posting this because i'm sure there are some people out
there who really cared about kurt cobain.  this message is
anonymous because i don't want to betray the trust of a friend
who knew kurt well.

: first of all, kurt *was* institutionalized.  about a week ago,
he was driven by a friend and member of his managment company to
a rehab center in l.a.  a few days later, after making a call in
which he sounded pretty good, he jumped a wall at the center and
took off.  no one could find him --courtney even had a private
investigator looking for him, to no avail. they had of course,
checked the house in seattle, but sometime after they had, he
showed up and killed himself.

: he was a very sensitive and tormented young man, and many
people will miss him.  this was not simply a selfish rich drug
addict, but someone who had a  very tough childhood, one which
money could not heal and which fame only made more difficult.
contrary to stereotypes, some of the people who cared for him the
most were those making money "off" of him.   people in the music
business aren't just about exploitation;  a lot of people tried
hard to help kurt cobain, whether or not the sort of help he
needed would line pockets.  so go ahead, bash the man or the
people around him, but do so with the knowledge that life and
relationships are more complicated than they seem.

: enough preachin i hope he is resting in peace.

: -please don't email directly to me;  i know nothing else.  post
responses on the net.


From: [e-mail] (MacGregor Group)
Subject: EXCERPTS FROM KURT'S NOTE
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 19:16:13 GMT

    Since it seems noone has yet posted this, I might as well.
    Reprinted from Tuesday edition of the Boston Globe.

-------------------------------------------------------------

    Nirvana singer and guitarist Kurt Cobain will be cremated,
 but there will not be an official funeral, a spokesman said
 yesterday.
    A private memorial attended by Cobain's family and friends
 was held Sunday night in Seattle.  Cobain's associates said
 they wanted to avoid turning any public service into "some
 zoo-type thing."  Cobain, 27, shot himself in the head last
 week, and left a note that said he no longer felt the passion
 to go on with his music.  Here are excerpts of Cobain's note,
 read by wife Courtney Love on a tape played at Sunday's vigil:

   I haven't felt excitement in listening to as well as creat-
 ing music ... for too many years now.  I feel guilty beyond
 words about these things.  For example, when we're backstage,
 and the lights go out, and the manic roar of the crowd begins,
 it doesn't affect me the way it did for, say, Freddie Mercury,
 who seemed to have loved and relished the adoration of the
 crowd.  This is something I totally admire and envy.
   The fact is, I can't fool you, any of you.  It simply isn't
 fair to you or me.
   Sometimes I feel as if I should have a punch-in time clock
 before I walk out on stage.  I've tried everything within my
 power to appreciate it, and I do.  God, believe me, I do.
 But it's not enough.
   I must be one of those narcissists who only enjoy things
 when they're alone.  I'm too sensitive.  Oh, I need to be
 slightly numb in order to regain the enthusiasm I once had
 as a child.
   On our last three tours, I had a much better appreciation
 of all the people I've known personally and of fans of our
 music.  But I still can't get out the frustration, the guilt
 and the empathy I have for everybody.  There is good in all
 of us, and I simply love people too much.  So much that it
 makes me feel too ... sad.  Too sad, a little sensitive,
 unappreciative, Pisces, Jesus, man.
   And I had it good, very good.  I'm grateful.  But since
 the age of 7, I've become hateful towards all humans in
 general ... only because I love and feel for people too
 much, I guess.  I thank you all from the pit of my burning,
 nauseous stomach for your letters and concern during the
 last years.  I'm too much of an erratic, moody person that
 I don't have the passion anymore.  So remember, its better
 to burn out than to fade away.

            Peace, love and empathy,
                Kurt Cobain

 -----------------------------------------------------------
 [Personal parts to Courtney and Frances were omitted from
  the published version - this isn't the complete note]


STELLA BLUE
From: [e-mail](Trout B. Rainbow III)
Subject: Journey on, Kurt
Date: 12 Apr 1994 23:21:54 GMT

All the years combine, they melt into a dream,
A broken angel sings from a guitar.
In the end there's just a song comes cryin' up the night
Thru all the broken dreams and vanished years.
Stella blue. Stella blue.

When all the cards are down, there's nothing left to see,
There's just the pavement left and broken dreams.

In the end there's still that song comes cryin' like the wind.
Down every lonely street that's ever been
Stella blue. Stella blue.

I've stayed in every blue-light cheap hotel, can't win for
trying.
Dust off those rusty strings just one more time,
Gonna make them shine, shine

It all rolls into one and nothing comes for free,
There's nothing you can hold, for very long.
And when you hear that song come crying like the wind,
It seems like all this life was just a dream.
Stella blue. Stella blue.


            Stella Blue
            by Robert Hunter and Jerry Garcia


KURT AS MEDIA PERSONALITY
From: [e-mail] (Tsirbas Christos)
Subject: Thoughts on Kurt Cobain's Death: A Eulogy of Sorts
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 01:42:04 GMT

On Friday, 8 April 1994, a young man committed suicide.  Such a
death would have gone unnoticed to all but a small circle of
friends and family were the young man not Kurt Cobain, leadsinger
of the group Nirvana.  Kurt's death sent shockwaves through the
world as young people grieved for one of their own, but one who,
unlike the vast majority, had lived the last four years in the
limelight as a media personality.

Personality is a strange thing, and a paradox. It is that which
is most unique and private about an individual, that which is
most mysterious and least understood.  Personality is also the
most public aspect of an individual, for it is this that
distinguishes one person from the next in human relationships and
communication.

Nikolai Berdiayeff, a Russian philosopher defined personality as
that about a singular individual that is a unique and
unrepeatable as a historical and existential event.  He also
defined the personality as the uniqueness of each individual
human being as the ultimate arbitror of all morality and value
systems--he considered personality as the most universal of
universals, as the highest absolute.

This goes very much against the concept of personality that has
driven the media circus surrounding Kurt's death.  His integrity
as a unique, unrepeatable, historical person has been violated by
the shallow definition of what constitutes a public personality
in terms of mass media culture.

Kurt Cobain, as a unique personality has never belonged to 'us'
or to anybody other than himself.  If we choose to honour him as
a media personality, then we are doing him injustice as a human
being.  If we judge him according to our standards and our
expections, then we have wronged his memory.  There is nothing
more tragic, nor more natural than the loss of a human life.
What we mourn is not the inevitable demise of all living beings,
but rather the demiseof a particular, unique personality that has
somehow graced us.  Whether that person is a distant rock star or
a close friend, we mourn the loss of a personality.

So let us mourn, but we must not mourn a person for what we made
(and continue to make) him out, but rather for who he was.

Kurt Cobain was a troubled young man who had the gift of being
able to share his pain through music.  To remember him otherwise
is to harbour a false memory.

To remember him as a junkie is to be blind to what pain he may
have felt.  That pain may seem petty to some of us, but then,
just like Kurt, we are each distinct, unrepeatable personalities,
and our reaction to similar pain, regardless if we have
experienced such, may not be the same as his.

To condemn him as a coward is morally unacceptable because we may
not share the same definition of cowardice that he did.

To label him poet-laureate, spokesperson of a generation is to
ascribe to him a role he probably did not want.  It also lends
credibility and mystique to his suicide.  It makes it an artistic
statement of sorts.  His death did not stem from this role, nor
is it an artistic statement.  It is the failure of a troubled
young man, the failure of a personality. We have no insight into
his true personality, at least not more than partially, but we
wish to ascribe a nobility to it and to his final act.  This is
selfish on our part, for we wish to create in this way a
personality that is our collective property, an entity that is
closer to what the media made him to be than what he may truly
have been.

To blame fame, his fans, and the music industry trivializes his
pain, and it numbs us to ours.  It is so much easier to blame a
failure such as his on cold, uncontrollable, impersonal external
forces than to face the fact that Kurt, like all of us,
essentially struggles alone, that--in the end--it is not the
outside world, but our interior being that often determines our
fate.  It is frightening to admit that any one of us, as unique
and solitary personalities, struggles alone, that there are dark
forces within each one of us that can overtake our being
entirely.  It is equally disheartening to admit that one we
looked up to was not as strong as we may have imagined.

To say that he was irresponsible in copping out on his wife and
daughter is to deny the possibility in our own lives that maybe,
just maybe, not all of us grow up to be responsible mature human
beings.  It is incredibly difficult for us to consider that we
will not rise to the level of responsibility demanded of us as
parents, spouses, lovers, and friends.  It is also frightening to
discover that the love of others may not be enough to make us
love ourselves.

These are the kinds of questions, doubts and thoughts that come
to us when faced with the suicide of an individual, whether that
person be a stranger, a friend, lover, family member, an artist,
or a media personality.   Suicide forces us to consider ourselves
as personalities, and it forces us to consider the existence of
others as unique and unrepeatable personalities.

Kurt Cobain gave up.  It is that simple. There was nothing left
for him that was beautiful or sacred, not his wife, his child,
his friends, his music, his life.  This is a real tragedy, for it
is the ultimate failure of a human personality. To say that his
pain represents our collective anguish is to reduce his suffering
to the absurd, to diminish it to meaninglessness.  This is
entirely selfish on our part, and it robs us of the significance
of his personality as a unique, unrepeatable event....


Chris Tsirbas
April 12th, 1994
===============

Drink entire: Against the madness of crowds!
                                                    -Ray Bradbury

Nothing's as obvious as what is lost,
Nothing's as painful as the cost....
                                                   -Blue Rodeo



From: [e-mail] (Jason Zengerle)
Subject: haiku
Date: 13 Apr 1994 04:12:17 GMT

the blood stained carpet
reeks of brains and gun-powder
smells like teen spirit




From: [e-mail] (PETERS, JEFFREY J.)
Subject: He Opened Up New Doors For Me...
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 05:52:00 GMT

      I never would have checked out The Melvins, or the
Vaselines, or Meatpuppets, or whoever. I never would have read
Suskind's "Perfume". Kurt opened new doors for me (us), we will
miss him.


[e-mail]                     February 24, 6 a.m.
                                       "There's been a body found
Go Irish! May God and Holtz           in Washington state, Diane.
watch over you!                         A young woman, wrapped in
                                        plastic. I'm headed for a
Clemens for Cy Young, 1994        little town called Twin Peaks."
                                                   Agent Cooper



From: [e-mail] (Alexander Schwenk)
Subject: Re: When/where was Nirvana's last show?
Date: 14 Apr 1994 16:25:13 GMT

[e-mail] (Kurt William Vogel) writes:
>Title says it:  I'm curious when/where Nirvana's last show was.
Did anything interesting happen?  Was it a good show?  Anybody
got a tape?

>-Kurt


It was March 3rd in Munichs Terminal 1 (old airport) (BTW: Mnich
is in Germany, just to prevent questions from those wimps who
don't know ;-))

A friend of mine was there, but he didn't tell anything magic
about the show. They just were loud and crazy and jumping off the
speakers at the end (like always).

Hope this helps!

cu     Alex       may Kurt rest in peace !


DISCOGRAPHY
From: [e-mail] (John P. LaRocque)
Subject: Re: Let's Try To Move On! Where's The Discography?
Date: 14 Apr 1994 01:12:09 GMT

In article <[e-mail]>,
PETERS, JEFFREY J. <[e-mail]> wrote:

>     Can someone please, PLEASE, tell me where the latest
discography can be found...

The local newspaper carried a Toronto Sun article which did
include a discography.

Four studio albums:
  Bleach
  Nevermind
  Incesticide
  In Utero

It also included a discgraphy of 10 studio tracks not on the
albums:
  1. Do You Love Me (from 1990 Kiss Tribute album "Hard to
Believe")
  2. Marigold (Heart-Shaped Box B-side)
  3. M.V. (All Apologies B-side)
  4. Here She Comes Now (from 1991 Velvet Underground tribute,
"Heaven and Hell, Vol. 1"
  5. Oh The Guilt (split 1993 single with Jesus Lizard)
  6. Even In His Youth (Smells Like Teen Spirit B-side)
  7. Curmudgeon (Lithium B-side)
  8. D-7 (from "ormoaning", a 1990 japanese EP)
  9. Verse Chorus Verse (hidden track on "No Alternative"
compilation album)

And finally:

 10. I Hate Myself And Want To Die (from Beevis and Butthead
Experience)

>[e-mail]              Kurt Cobain 1967-1994
>                                      "The raining always starts
>                                       when you go away..."



                       | "The final annihilation of the life form
John P. LaRocque       |  known as man. Let the attack begin."
[e-mail]|
                       |            Imperious Leader


LENNON LYRICS
See article following this one.

From: [e-mail] (James Lynch)
Subject: Re: John Lennon --- Not that great.
Date: 14 Apr 1994 04:44:08 GMT

Huge Nirvana fan here. John Lennon did not write exlusively (or
all that often) happy pop tunes. Try "Working Man's Hero" or
"God" ("I don't believe in Beatles") if you don't believe me.
They are both on his first solo album. By the way, Kurt would not
have agreed with you about Lennon. I believe he was the one who
said that there was no point in making any music after the
Beatles, but oh what the hell.

James



From: [e-mail] (Jason Zasa)
Subject: Re:  John Lennon- Not that Great
Date: 14 Apr 1994 13:27:36 GMT

Anyone who would claim that John Lennon wrote mostly "Happy,
Innocuous, Pop Songs" is obviously not that farmilliar with Mr.
Lennon's work post 1965.   I won't go on about this, and since
I'm not very familliar w/Cobain's work I can't really comment on
the Lennon\Cobain connection.

But if you think Lennon wasn't just as angry/suicidal/socially
pissed off/dark/hard-edged etc than Cobain, I'll just let some of
Lennon's lyrics speak for themselves:  You Nirvana fans who have
never heard these songs would probably really like them.


Yer Blues
    - By John Lennon (from the White Album, 1968)

Yes I'm lonely, wanna die
Yes I'm lonely, wanna die
If I ain't dead already
Ooh girl you know the reason why

In the morning, wanna die
In the evening, wanna die
If I ain't dead already
Ooh girl you know the reason why

Black cloud 'cross my mind
Blue mist 'round my soul
fell so suicidal, I even hate my rock n' roll
I'm lonely
Wanna Die
If I ain't dead already
Ooh Girl you know the reason why

The eagle picks my eye
The worm he licks my bone
I feel so suicidal
Just like Dylan's Mr. Jones
I'm lonely
Wanna Die
If I ain't dead already
Ooh Girl you know the reason why

My mother was of the sky
My father was of the earth
But I am of the universe
And You Know What It's Worth
I'm lonely
Wanna Die
If I ain't dead already
Ooh Girl you know the reason why


Working Class Hero
    -- by John Lennon (From John Lennon-Plastic Ono Band, 1970)


As soon as you're born, they make you feel small
by giving you no time instead of it all
Till you're so full of pain you feel nothing at all
A working class hero is something to be
A working class here is something to be

They hurt you at home and they hit you at school
they hate you if you're clever and they dispise a fool
Till you're so fucking crazy you can't follow their rules
A working class hero is something to be
A working class hero is something to be

When they've tortured and scared you for twenty-odd years
Then they expect you to pick a career
But you can't really function 'cause you're so full of fear
A working class hero is something to be
A working class hero is something to be

Keep you doped with religion & sex & t.v.
And you think you're so clever, and classless, and free
But you're still fucking peasants as far as I can see
A working class hero is something to be
A working class hero is something to be

There is room at the top they are telling you still
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
If you want to be like the folks on the hill
A working class hero is something to be
A working class hero is something to be

If you want to be a hero, just follow me
If you want to be a hero, just follow me...


I have a feeling Mr. Cobain may have been influenced by lyrics
like these.

Jay Zasa
    "Priased be wood; it is milk"
            -- Jack Kerouac



From: [e-mail] (GSM and CCH)
Subject: Re: Woman's point of view about song "Heart-Shaped Box"
Date: 14 Apr 1994 21:33:34 GMT

: One other question: why "like a pisces"? Kurt used the word
: "pisces" in his suicide note as well.  What are the qualitites
: associated with the astrological sign?  Or is it a reference
: to something else?

: Tom

Well, Kurt was a pisces, so that's probably why he used it so
frequently. The qualities that a piscean is supposed to exude (if
you buy that crap) are usually listed as:  very sensitive,
artistic, prone to addiction to drugs/alcohol, romantic, kind,
gullible, etc...

Fits the bill, huh?

-GSM


NEVERMIND LYRICS
From: "Ravnos " <[e-mail]>
Subject:       My final tribute to Kurt.  Lyrics to Nevermind.
Date:          Thu, 14 Apr 1994 13:10:01 GMT-400


Here are the lyrics to the album that put Nirvana on the charts,
why? We'll never know.  It is just one of those mysterious
things...

Ravnos Durga Syn


@ALBUM: nevermind
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Nevermind"
1991 - DGC 24425 [LP/CA/CD]

Songs: Smells Like Teen Spirit, In Bloom, Come As You Are, Breed,
Lithium, Polly, Territorial Pissings, Drain You, Lounge Act, Stay
Away, On A Plain, Something In The Way

Note: All but the first pressings of the CD include a bonus
hidden song after "Something in the Way" called "Endless
Nameless."


@SONG: Smells Like Teen Spirit


Load up on guns and
Bring your friends
It's fun to lose
And to pretend
She's over bored
And self assured
Oh no, I know
A dirty word

hello, how low? (x bunch of times)

With the lights out it's less dangerous
Here we are now
Entertain us
I feel stupid and contagious
Here we are now
Entertain us
A mulatto
An albino
A mosquito
My Libido
Yeah

I'm worse at what I do best
And for this gift I feel blessed
Our little group has always been
And always will until the end

hello, how low? (x bunch of times)

With the lights out it's less dangerous
Here we are now
Entertain us
I feel stupid and contagious
Here we are now
Entertain us
A mulatto
An albino
A mosquito
My Libido
Yeah

And I forget
Just why I taste
Oh yeah, I guess it makes me smile
I found it hard
It was hard to find
Oh well, whatever, nevermind

hello, how low? (x bunch of times)

With the lights out it's less dangerous
Here we are now
Entertain us
I feel stupid and contagious
Here we are now
Entertain us
A mulatto
An albino
A mosquito
My Libido
Yeah, a denial
A denial
A denial...


@SONG: In Bloom


Sell the kids for food
Weather changes moods
Spring is here again
Reproductive glands

He's the one
Who likes all the pretty songs
And he likes to sing along
And he likes to shoot his gun
But he knows not what it mean
Knows not what it mean
And I say
He's the one
Who likes all the pretty songs
And he likes to sing along
And he likes to shoot his gun
But he knows not what it mean
Knows not what it mean
And I say yeah

We can have some more
Nature is a whore
Bruises on the fruit
Tender age in bloom

He's the one
Who likes all the pretty songs
And he likes to sing along
And he likes to shoot his gun
But he knows not what it mean
Knows not what it mean
And I say
He's the one
Who likes all the pretty songs
And he likes to sing along
And he likes to shoot his gun
But he knows not what it mean
Knows not what it mean
And I say yeah

He's the one
Who likes all the pretty songs
And he likes to sing along
And he likes to shoot his gun
But he knows not what it mean
Knows not what it mean
And I say
He's the one
Who likes all the pretty songs
And he likes to sing along
And he likes to shoot his gun
But he knows not what it mean
Knows not what it mean
And I say yeah


@SONG: Come As You Are


Come
As you are
As you were
As I want you to be
As a friend
As a friend
As an old enemy
Take your time
Hurry up
The Choice is your
Dont' be late
Take a rest
As a friend
As an old memoria
memoria
memoria
memoria

Come
Dowsed in mud
Soaked in bleach
As I want you to be
As a trend
A a friend
As an old memoria
memoria
memoria
memoria

And I swear
That I don't have a gun
No I don't have a gun
No I don't have a gun

memoria
memoria
memoria
memoria {don't have a gun}

And I swear
That I don't have a gun
No I don't have a gun
No I don't have a gun
No I don't have a gun
No i don't have a gun

memoria
memoria


@SONG: Breed


I don't care
I don't care
I don't care
I don't care
I don't care
Care if I'm old

I don't mind
I don't mind
I don't mind
I don't mind
mind
Don't have a mind

Get way
Get way
Get way
Get way
Get way
Way from your home

I'm afraid
I'm afraid
I'm afraid
I'm afraid
Fraid, of a ghost

Even if you have
Even if you need
I don't mean to stare
We don't have to breed
We can plant a house
We can build a tree
I don't even care
We could have all three

She said  (X 8)


@SONG: Lithium


I'm so happy
Cause today I found my friends
They're in my head
I'm so ugly
But that's ok, 'cause so are you
We've broke our mirrors
Sunday morning
Is everyday for all I care
And I'm not scared
Light my candles
In a daze 'cause I've found god

Yeah  (x bunch of times)

I'm so lonely and
That's ok, I shaved my head
And I'm not sad
And just maybe
I'm to blame for all I've heard
And I'm not sure
I'm so excited
I can't wait to meet you there
And I dont' care
I'm so horny but
That's ok, my will is good

Yeah (x bunch of times)

I like it
I'm not gonna crack
I miss you
I'm not gonna crack
I love you
I'm not gonna crack
I killed you
I'm not gonna crack
I like it
I'm not gonna crack
I miss you
I'm not gonna crack
I love you
I'm not gonna crack
I killed you
I'm not gonna crack

I'm so happy
Cause today I found my friends
They're in my head
I'm so ugly
But that's ok, 'cause so are you
We've broke our mirrors
Sunday morning
Is everyday for all I care
And I'm not scared
Light my candles
In a daze 'cause I've found god

Yeah  (x bunch of times)

I like it
I'm not gonna crack
I miss you
I'm not gonna crack
I love you
I'm not gonna crack
I killed you
I'm not gonna crack
I like it
I'm not gonna crack
I miss you
I'm not gonna crack
I love you
I'm not gonna crack
I killed you
I'm not gonna crack


@SONG: Polly


Polly wants a cracker
Think I should get off of her first
I think she wants some water
To put out the blow torch

It isn't me
We have some seed
Let me clip
Your dirty wings
Let me take a ride
Don't hurt yourself
I want some help
To help myself
I've got some rope
You have been told
I promise you
I have been true
Let me take a ride
Don't hurt yourself
I want some help
To help myself

Polly wants a cracker
Maybe she would like more food
She asks me to untie her
A chase would be nice for a few

It isn't me
We have some seed
Let me clip
Your dirty wings
Let me take a ride
Don't hurt yourself
I want some help
To help myself
I've got some rope
You have been told
I promise you
I have been true
Let me take a ride
Don't hurt yourself
I want some help
To help myself

{Polly said}
Polly says her back hurts
And she's just as bored as me
She caught me off my guard
It amazes me, the will of instinct

It isn't me
We have some seed
Let me clip
Your dirty wings
Let me take a ride
Don't hurt yourself
I want some help
To help myself
I've got some rope
You have been told
I promise you
I have been true
Let me take a ride
Don't hurt yourself
I want some help
To help myself


@SONG: Territorial Pissings


{intro thing}

When I was an alien
Cultures weren't opinions

Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
I had better wait

Never met a wise man
If so it's a woman

Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
I had better wait
Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
I had better wait

Just because you're paranoid
Don't mean they're not after you

Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
I had better wait
Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
I had better wait
Gotta find a way
To find a way
When I'm there
Gotta find a way
A better way
I had better wait


@SONG: Drain You


One baby to another says
I'm lucky to have met you
I don't care what you think unless
It is about me
It is now my duty to completely drain you
A travel through a tube and end up in your infection

Chew your meat for you
Pass it back and forth
In a passionate kiss
>From my mouth to yours
'cause I like you

With eyes so dilated
I've became your pupil
You've taught me everything
Without a poison apple
The water is so yellow
I'm a healthy student
Indebted and so grateful
Vacuum out the fluids

Chew your meat for you
Pass it back and forth
In a passionate kiss
>From my mouth to yours
'cause I like you
You
You
You
You
You

One baby to another says
I'm lucky to have met you
I don't care what you think unless
It is about me
It is now my duty to completely drain you
A travel through a tube and end up in your infection

Chew your meat for you
Pass it back and forth
In a passionate kiss
>From my mouth to yours
Sloppy it lips to lips
You're my vitamins
'cause I'm like you


@SONG: Lounge Act


Truth covered in security
I can't let you smother me
I'd like to but it wouldn't work
Trading off and taking turns
I don't regret a thing

I've got this friend, you see
Who makes me feel
And I wanted more
Than I could steal
I'll arrest myself
And wear a shield
I'll go out of my way
To prove I still
Smell her on you

Don't, tell me what I wanna hear
Afraid of never knowning fear
Experience anything yoy need
I'll keep fighting jealousy
Until it's fucking gone

I've got this friend, you see
Who makes me feel
And I wanted more
Than I could steal
I'll arrest myself
And wear a shield
I'll go out of my way
To prove I still
Smell her on you

Truth covered in security
I can't let you smother me
I'd like to but it wouldn't work
Trading off and taking turns
I don't regret a thing

I've got this friend, you see
Who makes me feel
And I wanted more
Than I could steal
I'll arrest myself
And wear a shield
I'll go out of my way
To make you a deal
We've make a pact
To learn from who
Ever we want
Without new rules
We'll share what's lost and what we grew
They'll go out of their way
To prove they still
Smell her on you
They still, smell her on you
Smell her on you


@SONG: Stay Away


Monkey See, monkey do
{I don't know why}
I'd rather be deal than cool
{I don't know why}
Every line ends in rhyme
{I don't know why}
Less is more, love is blind
{I don't know why}

Stay
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away

Give an inch, take a smile
{I don't know why}
Fashion shits, fashion stile
{I don't know why}
Throw it out and keep it in
{I don't know why}
Have to have poison skin
{I don't know why}

Stay
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away

I don't know why
I don't know why

Stay
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away

Monkey See, monkey do
{I don't know why}
I'd rather be deal than cool
{I don't know why}
Every line ends in rhyme
{I don't know why}
Less is more, love is blind
{I don't know why}

Stay
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away

I don't know why
I don't know why

Stay
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away

Stay
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away
Stay away
God is gay


@SONG: On A Plain


I'll start this off
Without any words
I got so high that
I scratched 'til I bled

Love myself
Better than you
I know it's wrong
So what should I do?

The finest day
That I ever had
Was when I learned
To cry on command

Love myself
Better than you
I know it's wrong
So what should I do?

I'm on a plain
I can't complain
I'm on a plain

My mother died
Every night
It's safe to say
Don't quote me on that

Love myself
Better than you
I know it's wrong
So what should I do?

The black sheep got
Blackmailed again
Forgot to put
On the zip code

Love myself
Better than you
I know it's wrong
So what should I do?

I'm on a plain
I can't complain
I'm on a plain

Somewhere I have heard this before
In a dream my memory has stored
As defense I'm neutered and spayed
What the hell am I trying to say?

It is now time
To make it unclear
To write off lines
That don't make a sense

Love myself
Better than you
I know it's wrong
So what should I do?

One more special
Message to go
And then I'm done
And I can go home

Love myself
Better than you
I know it's wrong
So what should I do?

I'm on a plain
I can't complain
I'm on a plain
I can't complain
I'm on a plain
I can't complain
I'm on a plain
I can't complain
I'm on aplain
I can't complain


@SONG: Something In The Way


Underneath the bridge
The tarp has sprung a leak
And the animals I've trapped
Have all become my pets
And I'm living off of grass
And the drippings from the ceiling
But it's ok to eat fish
Cause they haven't any feelings

Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm
Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm
Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm

Underneath the bridge
The tarp has sprung a leak
And the animals I've trapped
Have all become my pets
And I'm living off of grass
And the drippings from the ceiling
But it's ok to eat fish
Cause they haven't any feelings

Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm
Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm
Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm
Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
Ummmmm
Something in the way
Ummmmm
Something in the way, yea
@SONG: Ummmmm

Source: Lithium CD single and the original recordings.
Transcribed: Vinicius Vasconcellos <[e-mail]>


 ***************************     .           Ravnos
* Sothi Nuinqua Tsalarioth  *    .      [e-mail]
*  -Faithful Beyond Death   *    .      [e-mail]
 ***************************

    On the edge of sleep, I heard the voices behind the door...
         The known, the nameless, familiar and faceless...
                My angels and my demons are at war.
                         Rush, Double Agent



>From Date: Thu, 14 Apr 1994 12:13:57 CDT
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: verse chorous verse

These are the lyrics to track 19 on "no alternative"
They now seem ironic

and if you save yourself
you will make him happy
and keep him in a jar then
youll make you happy
and give you breathing holes
then youll make you happy
and cover you with grass
then youll make you happy now

youre in a laundry room  youre in a laundry room
youre clue just came to you

and if you cut yourself  you will make you happy
and keep you in a jar   then youll make him happy
and give you breathing holes  then youll make you happy
and cover you with grass  then youll make you happy now

youre in a laundry room  youre in a laundry room
youre clue just came to you

youre in a laundry room  youre in a laundry room
youre clue just came to you

and if you fool yourself  you will make him happy
and keep you in a jar  then youll make you happy
and give you breathing holes  then youll will seem happy
you wallow in the s@!t  then youll make you happy now

youre in a laundry room
youre in a laundry room
youre in a laundry room
youre clue just came to you.........

RIP Kurdt, thanks for the memories,
Keith Lipinski [e-mail]


MEDIA SUMMARY
>From From: Sylvia <[e-mail]>
Subject: Cobain: media summary, Hilburn article summary
Date: Thu, 14 Apr 94 16:33:15 -0500

DISCLAIMER:
    I apologize for posting to alt.music.alternative, but not
all sites receive alt.music.nirvana yet. This is beyond my
control. Please do not yell at me if you don't understand how
alt. groups work.


With all this SHIT happening, I thought I would just post a
summary of what NEWS I've been able to piece together. This is a
NEWS group, yes?????????


This message is long, but at the end some details are included
from Robert Hilburn's Wednesday newspaper article.

Very interesting stuff.


TV:

On the Monday following Kurt's death, MTV played, uncut,
Courtney's recording of the public parts of Kurt's note, which
was played at the memorial.

While shows such as CNN's "Showbiz Today", and "American Journal"
played portions, only MTV played the entire event, complete with
an on-screen scrolling transcription.

While nothing in life is guaranteed, it is probably HIGHLY LIKELY
that this segment will be repeated on MTV's show "The Week in
Rock" this weekend.  If you have not seen this report in its
entirety, I recommend you try and catch MTV's "Week In Rock" this
weekend (if you're a fucking FAN, alright???)

MTV's report was preceded by information gotten from a telephone
call Courtney Love placed to MTV.  In the call, Courtney
discussed the attempt at a drug intervention using a rehab firm
she characterized as a bunch of "scum".

She mentioned that suicide had actually occurred in Kurt's family
history, but that her beautiful baby was going to beat the
"Cobain curse". She said that at the end, Kurt "drove everybody
away", and that there were business types who kept saying to him
"career, career, career".

After reporting on the memorial, CNN's "Showbiz Today" reported
on Nirvana's skyrocketing sales, especially for the "earlier
albums on independent labels." A video shot showed the Nirvana
rack in a store chock full of copies of "In Utero", but without
copies of any other titles (title cards were there, but no
discs.) One distributor commented that he was shipping twice the
normal volume of "In Utero".


Also on Monday, the television show "A Current Affair" did a
muckraking report from Seatlle on Kurt's drug abuse. An
unidentified junkie claimed to see Kurt in the junkie haunts over
time, and also claimed he delivered a hefty package of drugs to
Kurt's house from which they both sociably shot up.

On Tuesday, "A Current Affair" played footage of John Lydon, at a
book signing of all things, making disparaging remarks about
people who took Kurt's way out, wondering when "they'll ever
learn."


On Tuesday, MTV reported that Michael Stipe had an official
reaction. Stipe said that while he and Kurt discussed working
together, nothing was recorded. Stipe said that Kurt loved his
family, and his bandmates as well.

In yesterday's Philadelphia Inquirer, an article written by LA
Times writer Robert Hilburn (and I guess, syndicated in many
other cities as well) details a lot of the frenzied activity
leading up to Kurt's death, and the efforts of friends and
associates to intervene in a very serious situation.

[TIMELINE]
Interesting points in summary:

* The coma in Rome WAS a suicide attempt. "Sources say" there was
a note and all, and KC ingested 60 pills.

* On March 18, Kurt locked himself in a room with four guns.
Police confiscated the weapons, and accepted Kurt's
explanation that he and Courtney were arguing.

* Following this, Krist Novoselic was one of the people at the
Cobain house, unsuccessfully trying to coax Kurt back to reality.
The article mentions that Kurt and Krist have known each other
since High school.

* "A friend" claims that Kurt is in denial over drugs.

* Courtney convinces Kurt to follow her to LA, where she was
doing promo work, to enroll himself in treatment. He did, on
March 28, 3 days after Courtney got there.

* Kurt left the facility after three days without warning, and
Courtney hired private investigators, who were unsuccessful in
locating him. Clues were scattered, and rumours flying, but no
one saw him until the electrician found him.


++Sylvia



From: Sylvia <[e-mail]>
Subject: NYTimes: Op-Ed piece of 14-Apr summarized
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 94 09:28:43 -0500

If you are finding, as I am, that the media coverage of this
whole thing is not much better than USENET flame wars, you might
want to check out a very thoughtful piece on Kurt on the New York
Times' Op-Ed page in the April 14. '94 (Thursday) edition.


Written by former Times Theatre critic Frank Rich, who has two
teenage sons at home, the piece deals with the media
martyrization/massacre of Cobain, and whether the strong affinity
many people are feeling for Kurt's art and experience is telling
us something we don't want to hear.


Rich doesn't pretend to now be a fan of Nirvana's music, but he
did, at the behest of his sons, closely listen to the music he
had only heard through their bedroom doors, and checked out
Michael Azzerad's book ("Come As You Are").


This piece, by dismissing the noise around Cobain (be it from
Douglas Copeland or Newsweek) offers the only intelligent
analysis of the situation I've seen. Recommended.

(Am I typing it up? No! My momma didn't raise no typist!! :)

++Sylvia



From: Sylvia <[e-mail]>
Subject: Courtney arrest, Kurt was back on junk, Kurt OD'ed May
'93
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 94 09:29:55 -0500

    The Philadelphia Inquirer had the following entry on its
"People Page" today (Friday April 15). The source is either AP,
Reuters, or the New York Times. Individual blurbs aren't
credited. :-P)


_The Nirvana Notebook_

    The day before Kurt Cobain's body was found in Seattle last
week, wife Courtney Love was rushed to a hospital with a possible
OD and was later booked on drug charges by Beverly Hills police.
A police spokesman said officers went to the pricey Peninsula
Hotel April 7 to check on reports of drug use and found
paramedics taking Love, 28, to Century City Hospital. When she
left the hospital she was charged with possession of heroin and
drug paraphernalia. She posted $10,000 bail and is slated for a
May 5 arraignment.

    In other news, Love told a Seattle TV station Wednesday that
Cobain was on heroin when he killed himself, noting that
narcotics were found next to his body. A Seattle newspapersaid
tests showed heroin and Valium in Cobain's bloodstream.  "Kurt
was very depressed," Love said in the TV interview. "Some people
have thin skins. He tried things like Prozac but opiates were
what made him feel better."

    Also, Seattle police released a report Wednesday describing
a previous Cobain OD May 2, 1993 when he injected himself with
$40 worth of heroin, after which he shook and became delirious.
Love told police at the time that she tried to treat him with the
illegal drug buprenophine - sometimes used to bring users out of
a heroin OD - then gave him a Valium, three Benadryls and four
Tylenols with codeine to induce vomiting.



From: [e-mail] (Michael B Tierney)
Subject: Cobain: Latest victim of the WOsD ( was Re: COBAINS
DEATHIS IRRELEVANT TO THIS NEWSGROUP.
Date: 16 Apr 1994 03:29:00 GMT

Joseph E. Ckarke ([e-mail]) wrote:
: of concerns everywhere, not only here. Why is cobains death in
this newsgroup? We have drugs to talk about.

    Actually, Cobain is a fairly good example of someone who
needed medical painkillers, but was tortured by the 'junkie'
label that the WOsD promotes so heavily.
    His wife stated that she regretted trying to get him off of
'drugs', and in a great quote, that she should have 'let him have
his numbness rather than strip him to the bone'.  Cobain's
intolerable stomach problems gave him a MEDICAL reason for taking
painkilling drugs, such as heroin, but because of the
recreational association of those drugs, and the War on Drugs, he
was unable to get a safe, medical prescription for them.  Kurt
had also mentioned in interviews about how much emotional pain it
caused him to see the media paint him as a junkie, knowing what
his daughter might think of him when she was old enough to be
innundated with that message.
    No one is a fan of opium addiction, but if someone has a
medical need for a drug, s/he should be able to be prescribed
appropriate medicines for their condition WITHOUT feeling like
they are some kind of sub-human for needing that kind of
treatment.  Kurt was a victim of the ideology that it is somehow
preferable to live in excruciating pain rather than obtain
treatment with a 'socially unpopular', but safe medicine.  In
short, Kurt was yet another victim of the War On (some) Drugs.
Enjoy!
-me

Mike Tierney: [e-mail] ; CIS:70604,1512 ;
http://www.pitt.edu/~mbt

"One of the great joys in my life is sitting on my back porch,
playing a Hohner Harmonica, and smoking a hemp cigarette."
   -Abraham Lincoln, according to Hohner Harmonica Co.


POEMS
From: [e-mail] (Binesh Bannerjee)
Subject: Re: Kurt Cobain - RIP
Date: 12 Apr 1994 20:08:20 -0400

Lady of the Lake ([e-mail]) wrote:

: Kurt
: a real guy
: not a hero
: or a martyr
: I liked to watch you play your guitar
: didn't know you
: but I'll miss you anyway

: I imagine-
: the thing that you had to do
: play music
: made you the thing you hated
: famous

: i wasn't a die-hard fan
: i liked your music
: why am i so sad?
: who are you to affect me?

: the jaded shell of living
: is shattered

... Unfortunately *applause* doesn't seem quite right... But
thanks for posting
this...

Binesh

: -charis                     ** [e-mail] **

eeep! The .sig monster ate my .sig...



From: [e-mail] (Keith Ammann)
Subject: Cobain Haiku
Date: 13 Apr 1994 00:37:47 GMT


Kurt Cobain is dead
Many grieve, some moralize
I'm still underpaid.



                                          Keith Ammann is
 "Those who talk about the future are     [e-mail]
 scoundrels.  It is the present that      and a '90s kind of guy
 matters." -- Louis Ferdinand Celine,
 French Nazi collaborator                 "Dogs can't vote!"
                                          "Not directly."



From: [e-mail] (Jesse Garon)
Subject: Re: Cobain Haiku
Date: 13 Apr 1994 14:15:36 -0500


Keith writes:
>>Kurt Cobain is dead
>>Many grieve, some moralize
>>I'm still underpaid.

Steve K adds:
>Since Cobain is dead
>I hear constantly playing
>Smells Like Teen Spirit

The media sucks
Kurt Cobain pulled a trigger
But they blame the drugs.

    [e-mail]
    -----------------------------------------------------
    the imagologist suffers from the mania for signifying


SARTRE
From: [e-mail] (Chad Dickerson)
Subject: Sartre and Kobain
Date: 13 Apr 1994 13:27:37 -0400

Kobain's death reminded me of a passage in Sartre's _Nausea_.
Take it for what you will.

"The disc is scratched and wearing out, perhaps the singer is
dead. . . But behind the existence which falls from one present
to the other, without a past, without a future, behind these
sounds which decompose from day to day, peel off and slip towards
death, the melody stays the same, young and firm, like a pitiless
witness. . . . "


Chad Dickerson
[e-mail]


COURTNEY READS KURTS NOTE
From: [e-mail] (Bat)
Newsgroups: rec.music.industrial
Subject: Kurt's Note as read by Courtney
Date: 12 Apr 94 02:33:41 GMT

Windows .WAV file available on The CyberDen - 415.472.5527 in :
\cyberlink\cultures\alternative\sounds

Also available via anonymous ftp to cyberden.com (Same Dir)

-----

I don't know what to say. I feel the same way you guys do. If you
guys don't think... to sit in this room where he played guitar
and sang, and feel so honored to be near him, you're crazy...
Anyway, he left a note, it's more like a letter to the fucking
editor. I don't know what happened. I mean it was gonna happen,
but it could've happened when he was 40. He always said he was
gonna outlive everybody and be a hundred and twenty. I'm not
gonna read you all the note 'cause it's none of the rest of your
fucking business. But some of it is to you. I don't really think
it takes away his dignity to read this considering that it's
addressed to most of you. He's such an asshole. I want you all to
say 'asshole' really loud.

"This note should be pretty easy to understand. All the warnings
from the punk rock 101 courses over the years since my first
introduction to the shall we say, ethics involved with
independence and embracement of your community, it's proven to be
very true. "I haven't felt the excitment of listening to as well
as creating music, along with really writing something, for too
many years now." I feel guilty beyond words about these things --
for example, when we're backstage and the light go out and the
roar of the crowd begins, it doesn't affect me the way in which
it did for Freddie Mercury, who seemed to love and relish the
love and adoration of the crowd."

Well, Kurt, so fucking what -- then don't be a rock star you
asshole.

"Which is something I totally admire and envy. The fact that I
can't fool you, any one of you, it simply isn't fair to you or to
me. The worst crime I could think of would be to pull people off
by faking it, pretending as if I'm having 100% fun"

Well Kurt, the worst crime I can think of is for you to just
continue being a rock star when you fucking hate it, just fucking
stop.

"Sometimes I feel as I should have a punch-in time-clock before I
walk out on stage. I've tried everything within my power to
appreciate it, and I do, God believe me I do, but it's not
enough. I appreciate the fact that I and we have effected and
entertained a lot of people. I must be one of those narcissists
who only appreciate things when they're alone. I'm too sensitive.
I need to be slightly numb in order to regain the enthusiasm I
once had as a child. On our last 3 tours I've had a much better
appreciation of all the people I know personally, and as fans of
our music, but I still can't get out the frustration to gather
the empathy I have for everybody. There's good in all of us and I
simply love people too much."

So why didn't you just fucking stay?

"So much that it makes me feel just too fucking sad. Sad little
sensative unappreciative Pieces --"

Jesus man oh shut up.. bastard. Why didn't you just enjoy it? I
don't know. Then he goes on to say personal things to me that are
none of your damn business; personal things to Frances that are
none of your damn business.

"I had a good marriage, and for that I'm grateful. But since the
age of seven, I've become hateful toward all humans in general
only because it seems so easy for people to get along that have
empathy."

Empathy?

"Only because I love and feel for people too much I guess. Thank
you all from the pit of my burning nauseous stomach for your
letters and concern during the last years. I'm pretty much of an
erratic moody person and I don't have the passion anymore. Peace,
Love, Empathy, Kurt Cobain."

And there is some more personal things that is none of your damn
business. And just remember: this is all bullshit... And I'm
laying in our bed, and I'm really sorry. And I feel the same way
you do. I'm really sorry you guys. I don't know what I could have
done. I wish I'd been here. I wish I hadn't listened to other
people, but I did.

Every night I've been sleeping with his mother, and I wake up in
the morning and think it's him because his body's sort of the
same.

I have to go kow.

-- Courtney Love

----

Here is Bleeding Edge - Journal of Alternative Computing... issue #2
will come out soon (I hope). My first attempt at a 'zine.

--

TOC file:


    "/BBBBBB     /L   /EEEEE   /EEEEE   /DDDDD
    /B      B   /L   /E       /E       /D     D
    /B      B   /L   /E       /E       /D      D
   /B      B   /L   /E       /E       /D       D
   /B     B    /L   /E       /E       /D       D
   /BBBBB      /L   /EEE     /EEE     /D       D
  /B     B    /L   /E       /E       /D       D
  /B     B    /L   /E       /E       /D      D
 /B     B    /L   /E       /E       /D      D
 /B    B     /L   /E       /E       /D     D
/BBBBBB     /L   /EEEEE   /EEEEE   /DDDDDDD I N G

     /EEEEE   /DDDDD         /GGGGGGGG    /EEEEE"
    /E       /D     D       /G       G   /E
    /E       /D      D      /G           /E
   /E       /D       D     /G           /E
   /E       /D       D    /G            /E
   /EEE     /D       D    /G            /EEE
  /E       /D       D    /G      GGG   /E
  /E       /D      D     /G       G    /E
 /E       /D      D     /G       G    /E
 /E       /D     D      /G      G     /E
/EEEEE   /DDDDDDD      /GGGGGGGG     /EEEEE
The Bleeding Edge
Taking you where no one has gone before... to the obscure depths of truly
alternative computing, where desperate users ponder the future, and
stretch the capabilities of their machines to the utmost.

EDITORIAL

Hi folks, this is the first edition... send me any comments, criticisms,
etc... [e-mail]. Users of platforms not covered in this
edition (older workstations, Acorns, 8 bit platforms, antiques etc.
are encouraged to mail me tidbits for inclusion... only qualification
is, it can't be a "mainstream" machine).

Basically, this is just a compendium of news and views picked up off
the net, along with a little commentary interspersed on my part...
I try and pick up new and exciting things, as well as keeping my ears
to the ground for rumors... plus, I'd like to thank David Higgens
for his excellent article on the Supra28, an inexpensive accelerator
that gives new life to old 68000 based Amigas. And Hans Luyten for the
A2000 to A1200 keyboard hack. Send those articles in folks, and get the
ego gratification of being PUBLISHED. :)

Someone trashed my Unix account :( so I don't have the most exciting
stuff of all... the full "banner file" on the WARP System... a
scalable, multi-processor transputer for the Amiga that sits on the
Zorro III bus and goes ZOOM. It functions transparently to the OS, so
porting applications is relatively easy... VistaPro, among others, has
already committed to supporting it. All it takes is recompiling the
application using the WARP math libraries.

Lotsa buzz going around about HP and C= collaborating... sort of a net
consensus that when the Amiga goes RISC, it'll be with the HP PA-RISC
chip. Other news, widely known, is that HP is going to use the AGA (and
maybe AAA) chipsets in their desktop boxes. No one's mentioned what OS
they're going to be running, or what the CPU will be... late rumor has
from one net source has it that CBM is going to be eaten by Sony and HP,
and the AAA chipset will never see the light of day. Someone posted a note
to the effect that Sony's bought 30% of CBM stock... who knows what's
really happening. Other info is more positive, as you'll be able to see
in the stuff I picked up. Looks like the AAA chipset is pretty rad, 20x
the speed of AGA, with built in 3D rendering, and 16 bit sound support
(though the method on the last, is uncertain... in the on-line CIS
interview, Dave Haynie says that they're debating whether or not to go with
sound through the chipset, or a DSP, though he also indicates CBM isn't
doing much with the DSP. Puzzling... ). On the other hand, Dave Pleasance's
comment that NT will be able to run on the nextgen Amiga doesn't thrill
me at all... what role does AmigaDOS have in that case?

CD^32 selling like hotcakes accross Europe, even being advertised on TV
in Canada... what kind of impact it'll make here in the US of A is unknown,
as of yet. Rumor has it that near half a million units have been shipped...
someone mentioned they got it with a game pack for 250 pounds British,
which translates to $400 U.S.  But considering that UK prices are much
higher than U.S. prices, that bodes well for a quick drop to $299, The
various expansions turning it into a real computer are already on their
way... the SX-1 is mentioned herein.

The Emplant seems to have attained a reasonable level of stability, though
Jim Drew seems to be churning out revisions on a daily basis, almost.
4.x already! An ftp site has been established for various revisions and
patches... check out comp.sys.amiga.emulations for more.

On other fronts, Atari finally got a clue, and licensed the Atari platform
to a third party, which produced what looks like a pretty exciting computer
in the Pandora/Medusa. The Falcon seems to be liked by it's users, though
Atari's interest in it seems minimal... people are apparently doing some
rad things with the DSP.

And finally, my old standby, the TI, has some news of it's own...
apparently, a company has finally produced a reliable hard drive
controller for the last serious orphan platform without one. And, even
more interesting, several working emulators have emerged in recent weeks...
commercial, and publicly available.

Contents: (I've designed this so that users with GREP can pop right to the
juicy bits. Those of you accessing through WWW have it even easier.)<P>

SUPRA28 (search pattern in ALL CAPS) article. And yes, it does work in your
A1000. :) (might buy my dad one,
eventually)
KEYBOARD hack.
AGAFIX for banding problem on A1200s.
A4000 new models, and fate of '030 version.
ADVANTAGE AMIGA the "official" list! Help this guy out...
AMIGAVISION LIVES ... official word from CBM. :)
APPLEEMU looks like it's fairly workable... might use it to convince the
school/PTA people that it's finally time to put those Apple IIes out to
pasture. Over half the computers in US schoolrooms are 8 bit Apple IIs...
is this sad, or what? :(
PROGRAMMING is a popular hobby among Amiga enthusiasts... some spirited
debate between an Atarian and Amigan about who assembles faster, and a
fairly comprehensive list of programming languages available for the Amiga.
Most of 'em free, even!
AUSTRALIA (why can't I spell that right? :) Newspaper transcription, fairly
definitive word on the aftermath of CBM Australia going broke.
X-CALIBER hmm... seems like there's a bug in this baby.
CD32 EXPANSION specs for the SX-1 and other stuff.
BBKING uses the Amiga!
FRACTINT fun with fractals for the big boys...
GOLDENGATE the full spec sheet for the product that allows you to use IBM
cards in your Amiga, with your Amiga under AmigaDOS.
CIS CONFERENCE with Dave Haynie (Amiga God) and Randall Jessup (lesser
diety :) ). If you haven't read it for some reason already... stick it in
your files.
AMIGAFUTURE series of postings discussing AAA chipset, news about the next
generation systems, CPUs, etc.
HDDRIVE a high density drive for your Amiga... pulled off comp.sys.amiga.
reviews...
STUDIO full specs on the ultimate Amiga printer driver STUDIO software...
SCREAMER where the Toaster Screamer, (4 R4400s running in parallel to make
Lightwave [you guessed it] SCREAM.
FANTASY one Amiga users hearts desire.
SPREADSHEET not many of these for the Amiga, this might do the trick.
TRANSPUTER some stuff, not what I had hoped for... :(
[next edition has info straight from the source: U.S. Cybernetics]
ATARILYNX fix for button problems.
MACEMU software Mac emulator without ROMs?
TI-INFO a SCSI board, C compiler, the 99/5B (and where you can get photos
of the rarest microcomputer ever produced: 10 of 'em).


SUPRA28
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 1994 02:02:25 -0600 (CST)
From: Daniel Higgins <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: SupraTurbo28 vs VXL*30: cheap accelerator?
To: Thomas Leavitt <[e-mail]>



                              The ST28 and Me
                              ---------------
                                    by
                              Daniel Higgins

I got my Supra Turbo 28 accelerator about 9 days ago. I was tired of
waiting for my A2000 to finish doing stuff, knowing that so many others
already had accelerated machines. But, I didn't want to spend alot at the
time on an upgrade. Since I have no intention of getting rid of my 2000 in
the future, I went ahead and bought the ST28.

My experiences with the card
----------------------------
I have found the ST28 to be a great value, and I have no regrets
whatsoever in buying it. Installation was easy. The manual from Supra is
well done: short and concise, and not just some photocopies stapled together.

Since I have a 2000, the bare card goes right into the CPU slot (A500 users
will get the housing with the card inside to plug into their expansion
slot). For the A2000, a slot back-plate with a toggle switch in it is also
included; a lead on the inside connects the switch to the ST28. The toggle
switch allows hardware switching of clock speed from 7 to 28MHz. It can be
switched at any time, and the system will remain stable.

For my system, I also needed to set the jumper which disables caching of
the upper 4 megs of Fast RAM, since I have a BridgeBoard. I don't see any
performance hit, though, since I have 4 megs Fast and it's all in the lower
half. If you have more than 4 megs this situation will cause a performance
hit on programs running in or accessing any Fast RAM above 4 megs. No big
deal. If you have a BB you can't have more than 6 megs Fast anyway.

With the ST28, everyday use is sooo much nicer. For example, I use part of
my HD as an XFH partition (GREAT package!), which automatically
compresses/decompresses each file written to/read from it. From the
Workbench, each .info file on the XFH partition must be decompressed before
it's displayed; well, with the ST28, the compressed icons pop up only
barely slower than uncompressed ones with the 7MHz 68000. I have also been
able to increase the colors of my Workbench and use MagicWorkBench (ANOTHER
GREAT package!) without a speed penalty. And of course, LhA now flies, as
well as compiling, reading/writing disks, and even downloading is a little
faster.

I think the main point I'd like to get across is this: if you want to do
what you are doing now, only faster, the ST28 is the best buy; but, if you
want to move into new things that you wouldn't use your 68000 for, like DTV
or DTP, you'll want a 68030 or higher with 32-bit RAM. For me, the next
system upgrade I get will be a totally new box...the industry is coming
into a new phase, with retargetable OS's, cheap RISC CPU's and CPU-
independent local buses, so I think now is one of those rare times to wait
and see what unfolds. *Hopefully* my next machine will be an Amiga...if
it's still around, it'll still be the best. Till then, I can use my ole
A2000 and be happy.

+--------------------------+--------------------------------------+
| Daniel Higgins           |   Associate Tech/Software Engineer   |
| [e-mail] |   Texas Research Institute, Austin   |
|                          | and lowly Computer Science Undergrad |
|   // +-------------------+--------------------------------------+
| \X/  | Politics - who gets what, when, and how.  -unknown       |
+------+----------------------------------------------------------+

From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Will 28Mhz68000-kit work with an A1000??
Date: 15 Mar 94 19:51:55 GMT
Organization: Oxford University VAX 6620
Lines: 21

In article <[e-mail]>, George Ivy <[e-mail]> writes:
>Hi! With the recent flurry of info/queries re this recent hardware, I'd like
>to add another (sorry everyone...:)  I haven't been able to ascertain from a
>look thru these articles and an unsuccessful attempt to find a FAQ, whether
>the 28Mhz 68000 kit/thing will work (or can be made to work)
>with an Amiga 1000 (I have a PAL version running 1.3, with a 1MB insider
>board (ie 1.5MB total RAM) - which I can remove if necessary). Any ideas
>re this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

The Supra Turbo28 works fine with my A1000, although it blocks the joystick
port - you should easily be able to build a socket extension on some
flexible cable to get round this.  I haven't bothered, because mine sits on
the outside of my Xetec HD interface in the pass-through socket - clear of
the joystick port.  I get the occasional guru, but generally it works very
well with my HD and extra FastRAM, although I had to set the internal
(MACHINE) jumper on the Supra unit to the A2000 setting.

Bill Bennett
CRC Growth Factors Group
[e-mail]


KEYBOARD
From: [e-mail]
Date: Mon, 28 Feb 1994 13:01:42 +0100
Subject: Amiga 2000 Keyboard to Amiga 1200

Hi,...

here is my hack for attaching an Amiga 2000 keyboard to your Amiga 1200,
I build it several times,... here is how:


begin 644 A2000Keybd_2_A1200.lha
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end
--
        __   Physical-Mail:  Hans Luyten, Hofland 36, 4851TC Ulvenhout
 AMIGA ///          E-Mail:  [e-mail]    The Netherlands
    __///    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    \XX/      "Don't take yourself too seriously! What's the use...?"


AGAFIX
There's some debate going on over the net over the best way to do this...
he's some info from a CBM person.

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: [e-mail] ( stephen birch xd/n )
Subject: AGA banding in 31khz
Organization: Ericsson Telecom AB
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 1994 11:06:41 GMT
Lines: 33

I just got this information from Randell Jesup at CBM on the dreaded faint
vertical bands seen in 31khz AGA modes:

> From [e-mail] Mon Feb 21 19:34:02 1994
> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 94 13:37:31 -0500
> From: [e-mail] (Randell Jesup)
> To: [e-mail]
> Subject: Re: Banding on A4000s
> Content-Length: 730
>
> It's caused by crosstalk betweent the clock pin and one of the video pins on
> the 23-pin video connector.
>
> The only way to get rid of it is to remove the signal from that pin.  Yanking
> the pin _might_ work, but the crosstalk might be in the traces leading to the
> connector as well.  With a schematic you might be able to disconnect it
> futher away.
>
> The problem is that removing that signal breaks genlocks.  The connector
> pinout was specified for the A1000, and they didn't think about such things
> back then (there was some crosstalk there, but it ends up invisible at
> those speeds). We didn't see it on the A3000 because 31Khz modes went through
> the 15-pin connector.
>
> The capacitor fix sounds like some A1200 thing.
>
>     Randell
>

Any brave soul going to have a go?

Steve


A4000
From: [e-mail] (Peter Janes)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: Death of A4000/030?
Date: 27 Feb 1994 14:21:59 -0500
Lines: 28

In article <[e-mail]>,
Angus Marshall <[e-mail]> wrote:
>      I have just been on the phone with Silica Shop re my 4000. They tell me
>some possibly alarming tales. The 4000-40 has been split into 3 types: the
>full blown 40, the tower and the LC40. The 4000-30 has stopped being shipped
>by Commodore and they reckon that it is to be re-designed too. The re-design

>From Raymond Prachun, Amiga Marketing Manager for CBM Canada, at a local
user's group meeting on Feb. 20, 1994:

The A4000/030 is being redesigned without the EC030 daughterboard (i.e. it's
going on the main board).  This will _reduce_ the cost.  Otherwise it's the
same machine.  (A full 030 version was mentioned, too.)

The A4000/040 will still have a daughterboard; an EC040 version is coming.  It
will _not_ replace the full 040 machine.

The A4000T will be released _in Canada_ on March 5.  It has 2 video slots,
SCSI and IDE on the motherboard, and a SCSI hard drive.

Dates and specs are for Canada ONLY; other countries may vary.

PEJ
--
Peter Edward Janes                // | "I always wondered how Tom Waits would
 ([e-mail])//  |  sing Greensleeves...."
   Certified Amiga Developer   \X/   |    --Loreena McKennitt, _The Visit_
    ** SUPPORT CANADIAN MUSIC **     |      (liner notes for Greensleeves)


Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: [e-mail] (Richard D O Kalton)
Subject: Re: A4000T in sale within a month ?
Organization: Department of Computer Science, Warwick University, England
Date: Thu, 3 Mar 1994 15:24:36 GMT
Lines: 7

Here in the UK the dealers are expecting the A4000LC and A4000T within the
next couple of weeks (one specified late February / early March, another said
March 11th).

Richard Kalton
[e-mail]

COMMERCIALS
Apparently, fairly widespread... at least someone's doing something.

From: [e-mail] (Darren Eveland)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: CD32 TV-add schedule
Date: 4 Mar 1994 06:42:44 GMT
Organization: the Amiga Hut
Lines: 36

I picked this nice info off the C= Canada BBS.

This is the schedule of the television commercials (left)
for the CD32.  Note, this is of historical significance because
it is apparently the first time MPEG has been used straight on
TV for a commercial.  (I think it is the MPEG vsn of the commercial
that comes on the newer CD32 demo disc.  I belive a local Amiga
dealer is running the ad.

Station: CKVR
Local to: Greater Toronto Area

Times remaining:

Fri Mar 4 - 13:10
Sat Mar 5 - 23:10
Sun Mar 6 - 15:10
Sun Mar 6 - 18:27


GET YOUR VCR's READY!!!! :-)



Darren

--
+------------------------------------------------------------------+
|"Don't jump on the bandwagon, because it's headed over the cliff."|
+------------------+----------------+-----------+------------------+
+ Darren Eveland   | Amiga 3000-25  | 486DX-50  | Mac IIci         |
| Comp. Sci. Major | GVP Spectrum   | VL-BUS    | via Emplant      |
| University of    | Emplant Deluxe | 210meg HD | System 7.1       |
| Guelph, Canada   | 1024x768x8-bit | OS/2 2.1  | 832x624x8-bit    |
+------------------+----------------+-----------+------------------+

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: AAA Commercial(C= Commercials in General)
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 94 17:08:58 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Lines: 48

>        Since our machines have the capability, what, if anything, would
>be wrong with a group of users doing independent commercials for the
>Amiga?  Nothing specific, really, just show off the capabilities, and note
>at the end that all of the commercial was produced on the advertised machine.
>        I don't know anything about the legality of something like this,
>but since Commodore hasn't done the job, why don't/can't we, the users and
>lovers of Amiga, do it.  Not for them, but to promote the machine we use?
>        Sorry for the soapbox stance, but the idea of producing my own
>little Amiga commercial has been in the back of my mind for a while...
>
----------------------------------------+--------------------------------------
>    Scott M. Thompson        |    "Dead men don't make bad jokes,
>    Aspiring novelist...        |     do they?" - Jimmy Dix,
>    Internet: [e-mail]    |           _The_Last_Boy-Scout_


If you can get the $$$ together, I'd be more than happy to have my
production company produce it.  However, I think that you need to realize
the amount of money that you are talking about.  I don't think that the
Amiga will benifit from showing just a demo for 30 seconds.  So the best way
to go would be a well produced add.  The minimum for producing a 30 second
spot on film would run around $20-30,000.  Then you also would need to come
up with the $$$ to place the add on TV.  I have offered to produce adds for
Commodore for an extremely reduced rate (see Amiga World's CSM issue, that's
me... Thanks Mike!)  Anyway, unless there is an Amiga owner who can afford a
minimum of $250,000 for a total ad campaign, I'd say forget it.

Not that I don't want the Amiga to succeed, it just that no one - including
Commodore, has enough cash to pull it off.  :-(

Paul
aka "Darn Good Sandwich Guy"
**************************************************************************
                                   * My opinions are my own.  They do not
 Paul Griswold                     * necessarily represent the views of
 Director                          * FilmSmith International, or its
 FilmSmith International Inc.      * subsidiaries.
                                   *
**************************************************************************

ADVANTAGE AMIGA
A fair minded individual trying to assemble an "objective" set of facts
supporting the endless debate over which platform is better... a long thread
on .advocacy produced a fairly comprehensive consensus that the Workbench
screen paradigm is a big, big positive... helps keep things organized.

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: [e-mail] (Stephenson Daniel A)
Subject: Amiga Advantages List: UPDATE!
Sender: [e-mail] (Anonymous NNTP Posting)
Organization: Univ. of Southwestern La., Lafayette
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 1994 01:31:56 GMT
Lines: 42

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
DAN'S AMIGA ADVATANGES LIST as of 2/21/1994 compiled by Dan Stephenson
------------------------------------------- with help from all those
------------------------------------------- friendly folks at c.s.a.a.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
In an honest effort (truly!) to help strain out some of the crap that
goes on in the Amiga Advocacy group, I, Dan Stephenson, PC User, have
create this List to extoll those unique, useful advantages associated
with the Amiga computers.

If you have any suggestion, please send them to me at [e-mail].
I'm looking for fundamental advantages of the Amiga computer, something
about which you could say "Hey, but *Amigas* have ____."

Here it is:

 1) 'Screens' (multiple resolutions and palettes in the same monitor)
 2) Link clicking icons to _animations_ (and other things)
 3) *Standardized* co-processors
 4) IFF
 5) Good integrated video capability (Easy direct video output (nice for
    presentations)
 6) Fred Fish *organized* collection of PD software
 7) Datatypes
 8) AutoConfig
 9) AREXX support ubiquitous
10) HAM
11) Programmable resolutions
12) Strong in graphics imaging and modeling software
*************
NEW ADDITION:
13) Assigns
*************

----------
Please send suggestions to [e-mail]
Try to include example of utility if really obtuse

Thanks,
--
Dan Stephenson
[e-mail]


AMIGAVISION LIVES
From: [e-mail] (John Campbell - CATS)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.multimedia
Subject: Re: AmigaVision Alive?
Date: 11 Mar 94 15:35:36 GMT
Organization: Commodore, West Chester, PA
Lines: 51

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Harv R Laser) writes:
>>Hi.  When I purchaced my 2000 3 years ago it was
>>bundled with AmigaVision.  I have used the program to
>>very successfully create a presentation I do at the local
>>elementary scholl once a year about weather.  I missed
>>out on the AmigaVosion Pro upgrade by sending mony too late.
>>I never see AmigaVision for sale or
>>mentioned.  Is it still supported?  Is there
>>something with the same capabilities but better out there?
>>Thanks!
>>--
>>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>+ Ira Graffman                     | Meteorologist - Programmer/analyst+
>
>You should check with a dealer, I think. I've seen AmigaVision Pro
>for sale at Creative Computers' Lawndale CA store within the last
>couple months (please do not take this as an endorsement for them).
>
>Meanwhile, from our "Cosmic Irony" Dept. comes this news: Commodore
>Business Machines Inc. rarely uses AmigaVision themselves for their
>own press conference presentations. They use Scala. Which was evidenced
>at their S.R.O. press conference at the Consumer Electronics Show in
>Vegas this past January.
>
>How do I know this? Because at one point in the presentation, the
>correct slide did not appear or something and Jeff Porter of Commodore
>Engineering, who was on the podium at the time, fixed it on the
>spot by firing up Scala's interface and tweaking a couple parameters. :)
>
>The question I have is why CBM uses Scala for their own presentations
>and not AmigaVision, their own product. (And perhaps this tells you some-
>thing about what product to buy for your own uses (?))
>Harv
>[e-mail]

The question is easy, Commodore is a company not a religion.  Every employee
can use whatever application they want to give a presentation.

Secondly, I personally think for linear presentations, Scala is easier
for most poeple.  For coursware, training, and kiosks applications, I would
definately choose AmigaVision.  Some people may prefer other applications,
such as CanDo, Helm, Infochannel, or any of a host of other tools.

AmigaVision is not dead.  It is sold as AmigaVision Professional.  We intend
to continue to improve the product because it is an important tool for those
who wish to utilyze Amigas but are not comfortable with C.

Best Regards,

John Campbell
Director, Commodore Applications and Technical Support

APPLEEMU
Why? :)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
From: [e-mail]
X-Anonymously-To: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Organization: Anonymous contact service
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Date: Wed,  2 Mar 1994 00:29:07 UTC
Subject:      Apple Emulator on Aminet ready to use!
Lines: 78


July 6, 1992

                    Apple Emulator, DEMO version
                           By Greg Dunlap

    This program emulates an Apple ][+;  it supports all of the display
modes of an Apple ][+ - Primary and Secondary pages of Text, Hires, Lores,
and Mixed; sound, joystick, and Language Card.  It does all this while also
being completely multitasking! (It runs at a priority of -1)
    If you have a 68000, run "AppleM000".  If you have anything else, run
"AppleM0x0".
    To run this program you need to have a file in the current directory
called "AppleROM" - this is an image of the Apple ][ ROM.  If you have an
Apple ][ or ][+ you can save an image of the ROM by booting DOS and typing:
     "BSAVE APPLEROM, A$D000, L$2000"
and then transferring the file  to the Amiga via a serial cable.
     THE APPLE //E AND //C ROMS WILL NOT WORK!  This is because this version
of the emulator doesn't support the extra firmware bankswitching present on
those systems; such emulation is forthcoming.
    The emulator DOES emulate a Language Card, so that when disk support is
provided programs that live in this area (such as assemblers, UCSD Pascal, etc)
will work.
    A joystick is emulated via the mouse and a digital joystick in Port 2.
POT's 1 and 2 are MouseX and MouseY;  POT's 3 and 4 are the joystick up/down
and left/right.  Pushbutton 1 is the left mousebutton, Pushbutton 2 is the
right one, and Pushbutton 3 is joystick fire.  In the future this will all
be configurable.
    Although this is primarily an Apple ][+ emulator, it does have a few
enhancements: lowercase text is displayed and the 65C02 instruction set is
emulated.
    You will notice four gadgets at the top of the screen:

    QUIT - self explanatory.
    RESET - Same as CTRL-RESET on the Apple ][.
    COLD - Does a cold reset - same as CTRL-OPENAPPLE-RESET on a //e, but
           without the memory corruption.
    FREEZE - Suspends the emulator in order to free the CPU to lower-pri tasks.

    Clicking the right mouse button at the top of the screen will switch
between the row of gadgets and a screen drag bar.

    This is a demo version because there is no disk support, nor is there
support for a printer or modem; these are forthcoming.  As an extra bonus,
however, if you happen to have a 23937-byte file called "BOLO" in the current
directory, it will be loaded into "Apple memory" at $1100.  This is the
file "BOLO.BINARY" on the BOLO disk.
    This program has been tested on my Amiga 500 (68010, 1Meg CHIP, 2Meg FAST),
an Amiga 2500/30, an Amiga 3000, a stock Amiga 500, and a stock Amiga 1000.
It will run under Kickstarts 1.2, 1.3, and 2.0 (it may also run under 1.1 if
anyone cares enough to try it).

BUGS:
    If you run another program that uses sound on Voice 1 and turns the
volume off when done, the speaker will no longer click.  This is because I
cheated on the sound code by going directly to the hardware to click the
speaker; other programs that use sound aren't bothered by this.
    If you have another screen (Workbench, say) in front of the emulator's
and you drag it down, if the emulator is in a display mode other than
Primary Text then at certain points of dragging the screen in front will
appear munged.  This is an artifact of the copper lists I use to render the
display, and is COMPLETELY HARMLESS.

    I have not tested the sound on a machine faster than mine, because the
sound was never hooked up on the A3000 and the A2500/30.  I'd like to know how
it sounds.  Also, if anyone cares to try this on an '040 I'd love to hear about
it!

    Please send any bug reports or cool ideas to:
    gdunlap.ecst.csuchico.edu

- Greg Dunlap
- CSUChico
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
To find out more about the anon service, send mail to [e-mail].
Due to the double-blind, any mail replies to this message will be anonymized,
and an anonymous id will be allocated automatically. You have been warned.
Please report any problems, inappropriate use etc. to [e-mail].


PROGRAMMING
From: [e-mail] (Ralph Schmidt)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy,comp.sys.atari.advocacy
Subject: Re: Assemblers here and there...
Date: 1 Mar 1994 08:10:18 +0100
Organization: Universitaet Paderborn, Germany
Lines: 50

[e-mail] (Dave Wightman) writes:

>We use PSY-Q for our A1200 stuff, its the Psygnosis Cross-Development Env`nt,
>On a 486-50 with a Cached I/O card it assembles 38,186 lines of code (not
>counting expanded macros) with 26 included source files, 40ish bin files in
>around 5 seconds, and a further 3 seconds to download and Run 1.8mb of
>data.  anything else just wont do  8-)

You seemed to be pretty sure....

(A4000/40 Enforcer active and a lot other utilities)

BASM 1.92 (28-Feb-94)
Barfly Assembler (REG.)
Copyright  Ralph Schmidt 1990-94

Assembling : Debugger/debugger4.s

PASS 1
PASS 2

42421 Lines assembled in 2.470 Seconds and 0 Minutes.
This is a quote of 1030133 Lines per Minute!
Debugger/debugger4.s contains 9652 Lines.
90 Symbol(s) declared global.
286 Symbol(s) referenced external.
81 Macros(s) defined.
4155 Macros(s) called.
0 Includes added to the Cache
67 Includes found in the Cache
2 Hunk(s) created.
Optimizing saved 246 Bytes Code.
Hunk: 0 Name=`'
Start:0 End:$7288 29320 Bytes Reloc:453 Mode:CODE Memory:PUBLIC
Hunk: 1 Name=`'
Start:0 End:$B2C 2860 Bytes Reloc:0 Mode:BSS  Memory:PUBLIC

Output : Debugger/debugger4.o

Errors: 0 Warnings: 0
Assembling Ok! No Errors found.
Code type is position relocatable.Output file size 40408 bytes.
File saved in 0.154 Seconds and 0 Minutes.
This is a quote of 261.652 KB/s!


Regards
--
Ralph Schmidt                                            [e-mail]
University of Paderborn (Germany)

From: [e-mail] (Per Espen Hagen)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.applications
Subject: Re: Compilers for Amiga
Date: 9 Feb 1994 07:39:35 GMT
Organization: Forsvarets forskningsinstitutt, Kjeller, Norge
Lines: 36

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David Crooke) writes:
> In article <2j4ugj$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Per Espen Hagen) writes:
> > * Several Cs (SAS, Aztec, DICE, GNU, North, ...)
> >
> > * Several Pascals (HighSpeed, Kick, PCP, ...)
                                        ^^^I meant PCQ of course
> >
> > * At least three Modula-2s (M2Amiga, M2Sprint, TDI (?))
> >
> > * At least two C++s (SAS, GNU)
> >
> > * Several BASICs (including AMOS, Blitz, HiSoft, ACE, ...)
> >
> > * Several FORTRANs
> >
> > * plus Oberon (my personal favourite!), E, Ada, LISP, Prolog, Perl,
> >   Smalltalk, ARexx...
> >
> You can add ML, Forth, & Scheme to that list. I'm sure there are others.

Sure, that's what I meant with the ellipsis... also Simula, and a third C++
due out soon (Corneau or whatever it's called).

> And all
> of the above languages have at least one PD/Shareware implementation.

All? Is there a shareware Modula-2? Freeware Oberon? PD ARexx?
(I'm not counting severely crippled demo versions like the Oberon demo...)
But I know it's true for _all_ the others I listed.


--
Per Espen Hagen      [e-mail]   Tel: [phone]     //
Senior Scientist     Image Processing Group      NDRE, Norway     \X/

This sentence contradicts itself -- no actually it doesn't (Hofstadter)


AUSTRALIA
Lots of rumors, this seems to be the definitive word.

From: [e-mail] (George Sanderson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: article from Australian newspaper
Date: 27 Feb 1994 17:52:48 +1000
Organization: Griffith University, Brisbane, Australia
Lines: 49

found this in Sunday Mail (qld), February 27, 1994, page 99...
It has a few obvious acronym errors - usual standard for that crappy
newspaper.  Seems the only way for C= to make publicity is to go bust.

---

Good News for Amiga Owners

The collapse of the Australian distributor of Commodore Amigas, Commodore
Business Machines (CBS), will not leave new Amiga owners in the lurch.

Although the $40 million CBS has gone into liquidation, its warranty
obligations and spare parts stocks have been taken over by repairs and
services company CompuAid.

Liquidator Max Donnelly of accounting firm Ferrier Hodgson, said the
average Amiga owner will not suffer any problems with the 12-month warranty
on their machines.  Mr Donnelly is now advertising for expressions of
interest from companies looking to pick up Commodore distribution rights in
Australia.

However Greg Perry, Queensland co-ordinator of the Australian Amiga
Developers' Association, predicted the demise of Commodore Business
Machines would have little impact on the availability of Amiga systems.

"The situation will be up in the air for some time, but I believe it will
resolve itself and the flow of Amigas to Australian users won't be
dramatically affected," he said.

The Amiga range of general purpose, game-playing and professional
multimedia systems were "still the only multitasking machines in their
price range", he said.

The departure of Commodore Business Systems won't be mourned by many Amiga
enthusiasts who felt the company's support for their favourite system had
been lacking.

Among their complaints was the poor publicity given to the
recently-released Amiga CD32.  Featuring a new chipset, a double speed CD
drive and a module for handling the MPEG video compression protocol, the
CD32 was one the hits of the recent multimedia conference in Perth, Mr
Perry said.

Meanwhile, graphic artist Lindsay Whipp, one of Queensland's best-known
creators of games for the Amiga market is poised to bring out a new one.

---


X-CALIBER
A bug people should be aware of... X-CALIBER is apparently a super-speedy
memory subsystem for the A4000. 30 to 40% speed improvements claimed.

From: [e-mail] (Scott Bragg)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: A4000/40-X-Calibur-Z3 Fastlane
Date: 25 Feb 94 11:29:07 EST
Organization: Amiga Vortex BBS
Lines: 23

I am currently trying, unsuccesfully, to get a Z3 Fastlane and an X-Calibur
board to peacefully co-exist in an A4000/40  (all have latest revs of roms,
and Buster).  I have 32 MEG (2 16 meg simms) on the X-calibur and no ram on
the Z3 Fastlane and I'm using a micropolis 1.76gig SCSI-II Hard drive.

The folks at Advanced Systems weren't aware of a problem, however, the
X-Calibur tech said it won't work.  I'd have to wait another 4 months to
get THEIR SCSI-II card that was specifically designed for the X-Calibur.  I
really can't wait 4 months to use a 1.76gig drive.

Has anyone else encountered this problem?  Any solutions (short of pullin
the x-calibur and tryint to exchange 2 16 meg simms for 4 8 meg sims for
the Z3)?

Thanks

Scott Bragg
Amiga Technician at Showcase in Atlanta
-- Via DLG Pro v1.0


CD32 EXPANSION
News from England has the CD^32 being used in a wide variety of applications,
from Kiosks to multimedia presentations... apparently SCALA is working on a
version of it's software for this purpose. Also, there's a rackmount version
being produced as well. Amigan's just aren't satisfied until they've turned
their consoles back into full fledged Amigas. :)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: SX1: CD32 Expansion unit

[e-mail] (Peter Niel Olafson) writes :
>The SX1 (designed by Microbniotics, but released but MB's new owner, Paravisi
>on) willbe available in mid-March.
>It will have serial, parallel, floppy, IDE HD ports, a connection for
>the MPEG module, a Parnet adaptor (and software), and optional memory extensi
>on interface (up to 8 megs without MPEG, 4 megs with), keyboard translator
>(to permit use of AT-style keyboards) and microphone adapter (with both mini
>and standard jacks).

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: [e-mail] ("Dave Mansell")
Subject: Re: CD32 expansion unit for A1200
Organization: Citadel Software Limited
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 1994 23:22:15 GMT
Lines: 22

In article: 51786 of comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
[e-mail] (Jeff Stimson) wrote
>
>   <STUFF DELETED>
>
> Those of us with accelerator cards would rather not have a piddly little
> thing like Akiko hogging up a vital expansion area.  If push comes to
> shove, I'll get a CD32 and one of the up-and-coming serial or parallel
> connections.

A serial connector for the CD32 is already available from
Brian Fowler Computing Ltd in the UK:

email      [e-mail]

voice      0392 499755
           (outside UK ring) [phone]

----------------------------------------------------------
Dave Mansell - Citadel Software Ltd
FABRICATI DIEM PVNK - Motto of the Ankh-Morpork City Watch
----------------------------------------------------------


From: [e-mail] (Jose Elias)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.sys.amiga.games,rec.games.video.misc
Subject: Re: CD32 in USA has wing commander AGA
Date: 12 Mar 1994 16:14:47 GMT
Organization: Boston University
Lines: 20

Tom Bonge ([e-mail]) wrote:
: I got my CD32 here in the USA from mail order about 3 weeks ago, I assume
: it orignaly came from canada, it came with pinball fantasies and sleep
: walker (crap).  I just found out that if I had waited for it to be
: available in stores here in the USA I would have gotten Pinball fantasies,
: Wing Commander AGA and oscar.  I cant help but feel riped off.  I can't
: beleive I am going to mis out on the wing comander disc.  I as a loyal
: amiga user could not wait to get a CD32 and now because of that I am going
: to get shafted.  Oh and the USA version also comes with a discount for
: Microcosm, there now I might as well shoot myself for not waiting.
: Think there is any chance commodore will trade my pinball/sleepwalker disc
: for the wing commander/oscar disc?  None huh, oh well.

And where did you get this info from???

p.s.: I _HOPE_ it's true!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  .---'\/\/\/`--- - -  -    -      -       -      -    -  - - ---'\/\/\/`---.
  |                                  [e-mail]                            |
  `----------[  Imagination is more important than knowledge...  ]----------'

BBKING
... uses an Amiga! :) One user's worshipful account.

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: [e-mail] (Scott Thompson)
Subject: Professional Musicians and Amigas
Keywords: music, musicians
Organization: Texas Metronet, Internet for the Individual  214-705-2917 (info)
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 1994 12:53:35 GMT
Summary: who uses Amigas in the music biz?
Lines: 22

    I was shopping around at my local Amiga retailer (BTW, they sell
Macs, too... kinda funny to see the two side-by-side, so to speak
*grin*... ) here in the North Dallas area, and noticed some guy with an
apparently fat wallet buying Amiga 'wares like his money was water.  He
was buying a lot of music software, too.  Then I heard the clerk ask,
"Could I get your autograph, Mr. King?"
    I turned around and, to my surprise, there stood Mr. B. B. King
HIMSELF (*gasp*choke*... )!!  So, out of curiosity, I asked what Amiga he
owned.  He owns a couple, in fact, and, although he admitted he didn't
know a whole lot about them, he uses them for his music.
    So that got me curious.  With all the recent hub-bub over the
Hollywood Amiga (ie. _Babylon_5_, _seaQuest_DSV_, etc all... ), I'm just
wondering how many "big-name" professional musicians use the Amiga...?
Anybody know of other recording "legends" who use our beloved computer??

----------------------------------------+--------------------------------------
    Scott M. Thompson        |    "Dead men don't make bad jokes,
    Aspiring novelist...        |     do they?" - Jimmy Dix,
    Internet: [e-mail]    |           _The_Last_Boy-Scout_

FRACTINT
Fractals are fun fun fun... if you've got the system to do 'em with. :)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.applications
From: [e-mail] (Terje Pedersen)
Subject: Fractint for Amiga
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 1994 12:02:22 GMT
Organization: University of Tromsoe, Norway
Lines: 15

Is uploaded to WUARCHIVE.wustl.edu in /pub/aminet/gfx/fract

This is fractint version 18.2.

Fractint : the Rolls Royce of fractal programs..

It requires A4000. (or 68040 and OS3.0)

The source is included. So you might compile it for your 68000 if
you like..

have fun!

--
TP

GOLDENGATE
Find a use for all that IBM equipment you've got lying around... :)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: [e-mail] (Jeff Morris)
Subject: Re: GoldenGate board...
Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest)
References: <2jb8nf$[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 1994 16:36:55 GMT
Lines: 210

Phil Mucci ([e-mail]) wrote:

>     I seem to remember someone here marketing a product called
> the GoldenGate or something like that. It would map the ISA slots on
> the amiga's motherbopard into the amiga's address space so one could
> use the IBM cards - with the appropriate drivers of course. Could
> someone send me some information on this fascinating piece of hardware?


It's made and sold buy a gentleman by the name of David Salamon, but
unfortunately there seems to be a backlog of them, so they're next to
impossible to get. His specs sheet follows, along with  his E-mail address.

The GoldenGate I was an earlier "do-it-yourself" version of the card,
which didn't support all the features of the GGII.


 - Jeff

=====================================================================

   --------------------------------------------------------------
   David Salamon                Physics Graduate Student (Slave)
   [e-mail]           University of Illinois
   --------------------------------------------------------------

            Specifications for the GoldenGate II Bridgecard

SUMMARY
-------
  The GoldenGate II bridgecard lets you lets you use AT-compatible IBM plug-
  in cards in your Amiga PC slots as Amiga devices, controlled by Amiga
  software.  Software support currently includes drivers for PC serial and
  printer ports as well as PC hard drives and ethernet boards, with more
  exotic cards supported through the software emulators CrossPC (available
  with CrossDOS 5.0 from Consultron) and PC-Task (available as shareware
  from author Chris Hames).

  Example applications using the GoldenGateII:

     Extra serial/parallel ports using PC IO card  (serial ports can operate
           much faster than the internal port);  drivers are supplied

     Use a PC internal modem in your Amiga;  drivers are supplied

     Use IDE hard drives with any PC IDE board;  driver is supplied

     Cheap video using an PC S-VGA or other video board;  several users
           interested in writing drivers

     Use a PC Arcnet or Ethernet board in your Amiga; SANA-II driver is
           supplied for Novell compatibles, soon for Western Digital boards

     Use a PC EPROM programmer with your Amiga;  use CrossPC or PCTask
           to run the software

     Use various A/D and motor controller boards using your Amiga; no driver
           necessary-- just access the boards using C

     etc. etc.

PC HARDWARE SUPPORT
-------------------
  The GoldenGate II bridgecard will support almost all non-DMA PC plug in
  boards which are "AT-compatible", i.e. can support 8 MHz bus accesses.
  This includes such popular items as internal modems, multi-IO
  boards, non-DMA ethernet boards, VGA boards, A/D boards, etc.  Access
  to the PC cards is at full Amiga Zorro II bus speed unless wait state
  support is turned on.

  The following IBM AT bus signals are supported:

    IO address space from  hex $0000 to $7FFF (first 32K)
    Memory address space from  hex $90000 to $FFFFF  (448K)
    16 bit data bus
    All AT bus interrupts
    Wait states (IOCHRDY signal) for both IO and memory access
    14.31818 MHz clock (OSC signal) from on-board crystal oscillator
    7.2 MHz processor clock (CLK signal)
    BALE signal


AMIGA HARDWARE DETAILS
----------------------
   The GoldenGate II bridgecard AUTOCONFIGs as a Zorro II card, and it
   can be "shut up" off the bus.  The autoconfig size is 1 Meg to correctly
   map all of the PC memory locations.  All address and data lines to the
   PC bus are buffered to avoid loading.


ON-BOARD REGISTERS
------------------
   The GoldenGate II bridgecard includes 3 software accessable registers.

   Register 1 is read-only, and reports the status of all the interrupt
   lines, the master interrupt enable, and the wait-state control.  This is
   a 16 bit register.

   Register 2 is read/write; when read, disables the master interrupt
   enable and returns the same 16 bit value as register 1.  When register
   2 is written to, it sets the master interrupt enable.

   Register 3 is read/write, and it toggles the support for wait states.
   When wait-states are enabled, a default of one wait state (one Amiga
   clock cycle) is inserted into each bus read or write to maintain IBM
   bus cycle wait state compatibility.


SOFTWARE DRIVER SUPPORT
-----------------------
   Due to a lack of standards in the IBM community, there is simply no way
   to provide Amiga software support for all possible plug-in cards.

   A small number of standards DO exist, however, and we will provide drivers
   for some of these, with more coming out whenever possible.  The basic
   software package (compatible with the previous GoldenGate board) is for
   serial and parallel ports as well as hard drives:

     ibmser.device     a replacement serial device for internal modems and
                       multi-IO cards.  Includes automatic use of the 16550
                       FIFO buffer when available.  Support for up to 4
                       serial ports at once, equivalent of COM1-4.

     SerPrefs          set and save the intial settings of the IBM serial
                       ports.

     ShowSerial        prints out what serial chip is hooked to each IBM port

     ibmprint.device   a new parallel output-only driver for printing through
                       IBM LPT compatible parallel ports on multi-IO cards.
                       Support for up to 3 printers at once, equivalent of
                       LPT1-3.

     IOWedge           a wedge program that allows redirection of serial and
                       parallel port information to the IBM ports even from
                       programs that do not alternate alternate device drivers.

     NewPortHandler    this handler lets you use the new IBM ports directly
                       from the CLI, by creating a mountlist entry.  For
                       example, you can mount IBMPRT: and then issue a
                       CLI command to copy a file to the IBMPRT: device.

     SwitchControl     this is a small program to toggle both wait state
                       support and the master interrupt enable line on
                       and off.

     ibmIDE.device     this is a driver to allow the use of IDE, RLL, MFM and
                       other IBM hard drives.

     configIDE         this is a simple program to let you configure the drive
                       parameters

     NE1000.device     These are SANA-II ethernet drivers for Novell
     NE2000.device     NE1000 and NE2000 boards and compatibles.

   All programs require AmigaDOS 2.0, and were written by myself, Dan
   Babcock, Dan Zenchelsky, and Carsten Heyl.

   Details for accessing IBM IO and memory space through the GoldenGate II
   will be in the documentation.  Most boards that do not try to emulate
   system functions (like ports) will not need device drivers;  they can
   be accessed directly from your programs in C or any other high level
   language.

   For more exotic applications, the GoldenGate bridgecard is compatible with
   the software IBM emulators "CrossPC", sold by Consultron with CrossDOS 5.0,
   and PCTask, available from author Chris Hames for a shareware fee.
   Both CrossPC and PCTask will automatically find the GoldenGate bridgecard
   if it is installed, and map any IO location calls to the GoldenGate card.
   This allows you to use your IBM driver software directly.  Thanks to
   CrossPC and IBeM author Mark Tomlinson, and PCTask author Chris Hames!


GOLDENGATE II SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS
------------------------------
   The GoldenGate II bridgecard occupies one Zorro II slot aligned with
   an IBM AT slot in an Amiga 2000, 2500, 3000, or 4000.  It has essentially
   the same form factor as an XT bridgeboard.  You will need at least one
   additional open PC-AT slot for your plug-in PC card.

   The GoldenGate II requires 1 Meg of autoconfig memory space to be
   available.


AVAILABILITY AND PRICE
----------------------
   I am selling the GoldenGate II bridgecard as an assembled unit only.
   The price is US$115, and quantities are limited.

   Shipping charges will be US$3 within the US, US$5 to Canada, and US$10
   to anywhere else.

   If you are interested, please send me email at  [e-mail]



--
+-------------------------------------------------------------+
| Jeff Morris - [e-mail]                             |
|-------------------------------------------------------------|
| Beavis:    This .signature file, like, it goes beyond the   |
|            limits of good taste.                            |
|                                                             |
| Butt Head: huh-huh. yeah. It sucks!!                        |
|                                                             |
| Beavis:    Yeah! because it's too long. heh-heh.            |
|                                                             |
| Butt Head: huh-huh. you said 'because'.                     |
+-------------------------------------------------------------+


CIS CONFERENCE
The Amiga is alive and kicking.

From: [e-mail] (Dale Schlott)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Dave Haynie / Randell Jesup on CIS
Date: 19 Feb 94 19:56:07 EST
Organization: None.
Lines: 528

This is the complete text from a online conference on CIS with Dave Haynie and
Randell Jesup of CBM.

------------------------------------------------



10:02:31 PM EST Thursday, February 3, 1994

MarkM/MOD:
<bang> <bang> <bang> goes the gavel. :-)
I would like to welcome you all to this online conference.  It has been a
long time since we have had a formal CO.  I plan on getting many of them
put together in upcomming months.  Later this month we will have Utilities
Unlimited as well as GVP.  I have others slated for later.

Let me go ahead and send this formal stuff...

Greetings.
I would like to welcome our special guests Dave Haynie and Randell Jesup
from Commodore. Dave Haynie is a Senior Systems Engineer with Commodore
International Services Group.

Randell Jesup is the Operating Systems Development leader with Commodore
International Services group.

I ask that everyone keep from asking 'marketing' questions, or questions
about particular issues dealing with the sales of Amiga products.
These engineers have agreed to speak with us about current technology and
announced technology.

Since this is a formal conference, please ask questions by typing a
'?" first.  When I tell you to go ahead, then send your question.
At the end of your question--type GA to indicate the end of your
question so that the guest can answer.

If you have a follow up comment, enter a ! and I'll recognize you.

Randell Jesup:
Before we start, I'd like to let people know there
are things we can't talk about, of course.  Please keep that in mind.

KarlK: Guys, is anything being done about the port speed in the
next generation?

Randell Jesup:
Port speed? which port?

KarlK:
Serial and Par

Dave Haynie:
We realize some limitations are present in the current serial
implementation.  The main problem is the lack of a FIFO, something that was
added in the latest generation of PClone serial ports.  We have looked into
addressing that.  On the other hand, we don't have any immediate plans to
offer a complete IEEE 1284 parallel port, but it is likely that future
systems will offer a faster mode that could conceivable become an IEEE 1284
work-alike.

Ron Romine:
Does the Custom Chips (Lisa & Alice) run at 7mhz or 14mhz? And if 14mhz,
have they always had that speed capibility?

Dave Haynie:
I guess that's a HW question too.  The concept of "running at" a specific
clock speed is an architecture-dependent thing.  The Lisa chip's input clock
is 28MHz (nominal), the Alice's inp ut clock is 14MHz.  Alice runs the same
bus cycle as a 14MHz 68000, in terms of clock count.  Lisa's data transfer
is more like that of a 14MHz 68030, in terms of how much data is transferred
per cycle (eg, Lisa runs a 32-bit burstcycle). The ECS and original chip set
was also equivalent to a 14MHz 68000 in cycle speed.

Clark:
Any ideas to add a true spooler for printing & is DSP going to be there?

Randell Jesup:
No one is currently working on a spooler, though there are versions available
in the PD I think.

As for DSP, there are already some DSP boards available (sunrise), and we've
been making projects we don't currently have time to finish are available to
developers.  I think you'll see the ex-Commodore DSP board soon.

MarkM/MOD:
What is the real problem with A4000s that will not cold boot?

Dave Haynie:
The last I heard on that problem, it was some kind of start up problem with
the Seagate IDE hard drives.  I don't know the final analysis, although I
don't believe it was a stiction problem (similar symptoms were due to this
on some Quantums a few years back).  Greg Berlin did find and address the
problem several months back.

Randell Jesup:
Also, I think it was an interaction between the power-supply rise-time and
the drive.  It wasn't stiction, I heard the results from Schilling.

Ron Romine:
Is this a problem with IDE SPT and battmem not waiting long enough?

Randell Jesup:
No, it's the rise time of the PS voltage confusing the drive.  Battmem isn't
involved.  Other drives are fine.

Dave Haynie:
The problem addressed was a drive-specific thing, related to the drive's
initialization interacting with the power-supply startup.  This is NOT the
"traditional" Seagate slow-boot problem, which is a SCSI-specific thing if
I'm not mistaken.

Dean/DKB:
In the next released OS, will there be support for multiple printers?

Randell Jesup:
Printers: If we can find time and resources, we'd like to get that done.
It shouldn't be too hard. It's not top priority, of course.

Jim Philippou:
What type & speed processor are you planning for the Amiga NG?

Dave Haynie:
The next generation (which, incidently, will try to give some consideration
to A3000/A4000 owners) will pick up with high speed '040s and '060s.  Given
a modular processor interface, and of course what you have all heard from
Lew Eggebrecht's talks, RISC is a drop-in at some point as well.

Jim Philippou:
Are you planning to build any type CPU board that fits into an A3000 with
the higher processing power?

Dave Haynie:
The A3000 currently supports A4000 processor modules (I'm soaking in one).
The real problem, and why we did not recommend the A3640 module for use in
the A3000, is that the 68040 came out significantly hotter than we had
planned for.  Going to 3V in future processors, plus some things we can do
to our own system implementation, should (eg, we believe so at this point,
I can't promise with absolute [certainty]) yield modules that work in all
A3000/A4000.

Ron Romine:
Will "3.1" be a Workbench upgrade for "3.0-Roms", or require 3.1-Roms.

Randell Jesup:
3.1 WB will not require 3.1 roms.  It will require 3.0 or above.

Mike Smith:
So when will we probably maybe see the "5000"?? i.e. is it finished yet?

Dave Haynie:
I can't give you a date for the Next Generation Machine (call it A5000 if
you like, the name is a marketing decision, of course).

I have been at work on next generation technologies for the past 2-3 years,
our chip group longer than that.  We know what the system is going to look
like, and have some idea of when things will be ready.  The design was done
a bit differently than in the past.  Things are intended to be more modular.
So you may see the first of these new things show up for the A4000 before
the next generation system(s) actually are ready.

Chris Tolmie:
When  will we see C= support CDROM drives for the A2-4000 series of Amigas?

Randell Jesup:
If you mean other than SCSI drives, I think Lew has mentioned that we're
working on some adapters.  Not so much for getting cheap CDROMs (though that
may be), but so you can use CD32 titles and access methods (and mpeg). We
already support SCSI CDROM drives, and 3.1 has a CDFileSystem (from CDTV/CD32)
included.

Erik Flom:
Re: the "Internal Audio Conn." on A4000s, what are the pinouts for this
connector?  I've found a vendor with and adaptor, but the sound level of the
external audio is about half of what the internal Amiga Audio is.  Is there
some way of controlling the input level? (Like on PC sounds boards? :^)

Dave Haynie:
I don't have the A4000 schematics handy.  Last I recall, it was a 3-pin
header that just mixes into the traditional Amiga audio output.  We did a
similar thing on the A3000T.  This lets you hook up a CD-ROM or DSP audio
source without the need for external mixing.

Stuart H. Brand:
Re: AAA sound support, will it be 8 Ch, 16 bit?

Dave Haynie:
The planned AAA audio subsystem is essentially an upgrade of the traditional
Amiga audio.  Rather than four DMA channels at 8-bits/channel (6 volume), it
supports 8 DMA channels at 16-bits/channel (with volume, though I don't
recall the resolution).  There is some question as to whether this traditional
Amiga solution is the best way to go, since the DSP technology we developed
(but have yet to place) offers more flexibility.  I think you can count on
16-bit audio in the next generation system, hopefully it will be the best
system for the $$$ we can provide.

Ron Romine:
Can the current A1200 IDE-HD interface support an IDE CD-ROM drive, if the
drive matched IDE standards and provided its own power supply?

Randell Jesup:
Well, it might.  I don't have an IDE CDROM.  If it acts like a disk drive,
including acting as if it's using 512-byte sectors, then it should probably
work.  It won't notice disk removals, at least in anything before 3.1
(in 3.1 it might).  However, if the startup code decides that the thing
attached is not a disk, it won't let you access it.  So the answer is: maybe.
The ATA committee is working on something called ATAPI.  ATAPI is basically
SCSI over an AT interface.  To use it, we'd need a new driver.  I follow both
the SCSI and ATA committees.

Jim Philippou:
What are the major features in V3.1 compaired to V2.04 and can you comment
on availability?

Randell Jesup:
3.1 vs. 2.04...
Hmm, where to start?  There are a lot of changes.  There's a new filesystem
(dircache).  Multiview and the datatype library and classes.  A bunch of WB
disk enhancements (to mount, the layout of things, etc).  HDtoolbox is
new-look.  Of course you get all the 2.1 stuff too (locale in particular).
Check magazine articles for a more exhaustive list.  3.1 is a Good Thing.

MarkM/MOD:
Availability?  Can you comment on that?

Randell Jesup:
Availability... That's really a marketing thing, including how it will be
made available.  It should be soon, though.  It's quite stable.

jon:
What will the graphic and animation capabilities of the Next Generation
Machine be like? Will RTG/DIG be a part of it?

Dave Haynie:
So, ya wanna talk graphics and animation.  I could write a book on this.
In fact, some have.  In general, bigger, better, faster, more.  You will
have an improved (eg, faster) blitter.  Graphics hardware handles chunky
pixels, 16 and 24-bit direct color.  Non-interlaced resolutions can go up
to 1280x1024 (not necessarily at 24-bit, however).  RTG will be an integral
feature of the next generation, and in fact necessary to handle chunky mode
pixels, for instance.

jon:
Will RTG be homegrown, or could EGS be adopted?  Its here.

Randell Jesup:
RTG: We haven't ruled out EGS - I'm not the primary gfx guy, so I don't know
all the details.  However, most likely we'd want something that kept as much
as possible compatibility with current software and calls.  I 'm not sure if
it gives the most for that, because I (personally) haven't looked.  The GFX
guys are doing that.

Fred Murray:
The latest setpatch (40.14 I believe) had a fix for A600s with Conner hd's.
Is there any chance a patch can fix this slow Seagate (st-914) slow seagate
in my 1200?

Randell Jesup:
We can't easily make a slow drive faster, unless you have a good trick for
making time run faster.... ;-)

Fred Murray:
Well, 200k/sec reads are quite slow!

Randell Jesup:
If there's a specific problem, perhaps.  However it would hav e to be a major
problem.  Note that many 2.5 drives _are_slow.  They weren't designed for
speed. If you need a fast 2.5" drive, buy one to start, or use something like
external caching software.

Paul Idol:
Will the 4000, or the rumoured low-cost 4000, be upgradable in any way to
future architectures and OS versions, like AAA and OS 4.0, or whatever
comes after 3.1?  For example, will Zorro II and III cards be usable by
future machines and vice versa?

Dave Haynie: Yes.

Paul Idol: How completely?

Randell Jesup:
New OS versions are usually runnable on older machines.  That will continue
so Zorro is Zorro, as far as we are concerned.  As long as it's possible.

Paul Idol:
Well, I heard about PCI - and 3.0 was never released for AGA machines.
And what about AAA for 4000s?

Dave Haynie:
Future machines with Zorro slots will run faster Zorro III, but that's a
controller/system interface function.  It does not impact on a card's design.
I am currently in the process of looking into adapting some evolving
technologies for A4000 use, officially.  Like I tried to point out earlier,
a major new system doesn't happen all at once.  Since our next generation
architecture is modular, pieces can be adapted for A4000 use before the
A5000 is ready.  I expect this will happen.  PCI is a long term key to low
cost modularity.  Back in 1991 I started working on the post-A4000
architecture.  I designed a "modular interconnect bus", which I  called the
AMI bus, for this purpose.  Later in '92, PCI was unveiled, and it no longer
made any sense to go the custom route.  Still, PCI or AMI, the main point of
this design is to support on-motherboard modules, like graphics, CPU, etc.
It's a local bus replacement.  It does allow us to make an intermediate
machine expandable via a PCI slot or two, but that's about the limit on free
PCI slots.  I expect a full blown slotted Amiga would also have Zorro slots,
much like PCI-based Clones have EISA or ISA.

Steve Ahlstrom:
Dave, even tho you are working on new hardware, do you see any signs that
CBM is interested in anything other than CD32?  Do you have the manpower
necessary to develop both hardware and software for future computer
products?

Randell, you say you aren't the primary gfx (software) guy... who is?

Dave Haynie:
Steve, I have needed more manpower ever since I started at C= back in '83.

Randell Jesup:
Allan Havemose is head of Amiga software, and is covering GFX until we hire
more GFX people. (He used to be head of the GFX group).  I'm in charge of
the OS group (ie. everything not GFX or UI, basically).

Steve Ahlstrom:
Ok .. guess I'm asking if there is an upbeat feeling or are you guys looking
for jobs?

Dave Haynie:
We have enough folks on the high-end, and a few we share with the low-end,
to do what we need to do.  I would like more, it would make the "A5000"
happen faster.  However, like I mentioned, you don't have to necessarily
wait for the A5000 to see the fruit of our next generation labors, if all
goes well.  You do have to have every piece in place to get an A5000,
obviously.

Randell Jesup:
We have posted on the Internet requests for resume for GFX people, and may
well be posting more positions soon (in software).  In GFX, we also have Ken
Dyke and Fredrick Shaw  (a new hire from Ensoniq).  Obviously, things have
been better.  However, sales are looking up with the CD32 introduction and
1200 sales.

Stuart H. Brand:
Will there be a return of speech synthesis (localized) or perhaps voice
recognition, or are these better suited to 3rd party developers?

Randell Jesup:
Speech synth: we've been negotiating with some people, so you may see it
re-added (and better), as well as possibly non-English languages.  Many of
our machines are sold to non-english-speakers, and the old narrator didn't
help them much.  However, no promises.  We don't have a lot of money to
throw around, and I don't know if it will happen.  As for recognition: we'll
leave that to third parties.  It probably requires a DSP or a very fast
processor.

Mike Smith:
What part of A5000 will we see first and when?

Dave Haynie:
The main interests seem to be adapting "A5000" CPU and graphics subsystems
to the A4000.  The next generation CPU subsystem is perhaps the simplest
adaptation, though we're technically further along in graphics.  I can't
really predict which will get out first.  Also, as I mentioned, our DSP
technology has been reasonably solid for a year.  It has been licensed out
to third parties, and if we do decide that's the best route  for motherboard
audio in the it may wind up adapted to the A4000.  In engineering, I'm
responsible for telling the company what's possible and "making it so" when
they have decided on the course of action.  Of course, I do attempt to
influence the directions the way I see fit, but I don't have total control.
Once a complete "technology" is done, adapting it for use on a card may
be accomplished in a matter of months, so it's not like stuff that is
now working will have to wait 'til '95 or anything to be released, if that's
the course C= decides to steer.

Michael:
Forget about everything you _really_ know about CBM, and forget about who you
work for.  Would each of you tell us what three things YOU would MOST like to
see in the NG machine?

Dave Haynie:
Ok, me first.

[1] Graphics.  I have an oMniBus card here on my Amiga.  It does
1180x900 noninterlaced, but its not fast.  I want to have state of the
art graphics on the next generation system, coupled with RTG.
"State of the art" is sometimes a matter of months, that's where RTG
comes in.

[2] Modularity.  Since the A2000, I have been a fan of modular
systems.  Look at the A2000.  By the time it was done, you had a
tricked out A2500 that ended about where the A3000 began.  I believe
that's the way it should be done, and I hope I can return to this
philosophy w.r.t. the A3000/A4000 vs The New Thing.  Also, I think
new architecture can make modularity nearly free -- the cost of
modularity has also been a concern.

[3] DSP.  I worked on the DSP project for about a year and a half, and I
seriously believe it is the way sound will be done in the future.
I think even the conservative PClone industry is thinking this way.
Good sound effects in a program are probably done just as well with lots
of DMA channels.  The real advantage of the DSP is the sounds I expect to
hear once some good audio hackers have 25-33MFLOPs to play around with.

Randell Jesup:
1) Graphics.  One guy here has a Picasso 2.  I want it.  Resolution
is _wonderful_.  I use a Moniterm, and find 640 or 800 too narrow. As Dave
said, to be able to get state-of-the-art you need to have good RTG.

2) CPU.  As with most software people, I want _speed_.  More
CPU means we can build software faster (since we can layer it more with
out performance problems), and more generically (classes, things like data
types, etc).  Obviously we can get faster Motorola CPU's (faster '040's,
 faster memory systems, and the '060 is coming soon from them.
In the long run, RISC is the only way to go.  I've been promoting RISC
Amigas around here since '89 or '90.  Back at GE Corporate Research, I
was a member of a RISC CPU development team (the RPM-40).

3) hmmmm.
I usually don't think about it this way.
I'd very much like the see the DSP stuff come out; I was the software
"contact" for it (Eric Lavitsky was doing most of the sw work under
contract).  I'd also like to see improvements in the OS.  Unfortunately,
it's become hard to make fundamental changes to the OS due to compatibility.
For example, protection is a major pain to try to do under Amigados.
VM is possible, if a bit kludy.  Eventually we may have to make some level
of break with 100% compatibility to move forward.  However, don't expect that
too soon, and it may be tied to CPU issues.  Oh well, I've rambled enough.

Michael:
Now, on a scale of 1 to 10, how much credence does CBM give _your_ ideas of
what's important, as you just outlined?

Dave Haynie:
Letsee here...

Randell Jesup:
Both of us meet with Lew fairly often.  Our ideas are fairly in accordance
with his, I think.  That doesn't mean we'll get all we want, necessarily.
I think these broad sweeps we've given are both pretty obvious and likely.

Dave Haynie:
[1] I think Lew sees eye-to-eye with me on many of these issues. The overall
next generation plan I worked on starting back in '91 or so was picked up on
by Lew and some advanced research stuff he was working on with Ed Hepler
(our main Chip group advanced architecture guy) independently of what I was
working on.  Yet, when presented in some decently complete form, both ideas
were not only along the same lines, but had the hardware magically appeared
before us, they would have played together.

[2] see 1.  Graphics is the priority, plain and simple.  That's with good
multimedia support, we want to do things the Amiga way.

[3] The issues aren't settled by any means, but things do seem to be warming
to DSP.  I think a realization of our DSP technology in the market by 3rd
parties in the immediate future, plus standardization on DSP as the next
generation sound device in the industry (Apple has already, but it'll take
the Clone biz to seal the deal) should promote my goals.  After all, it
already works, and the simple things like "play a sample" or "record to disk"
are essentially built-ins under VCOS/VCAS.

MarkM/MOD:
Let me ask one final question... you have heard the doomsayers.  Many Amiga
owners are depressed.  I think this CO will help a lot by the way. Is there
anything you would like to say to the Amiga community in general?

Dave Haynie:
Sure.  I'd just like to wax philosophic for a second or two.
I think the only way to address a problem of any kind is to move directly
into it.  Perhaps its too much Aikido practice, but I think any other way
you're doomed.  That isn't necessarily C='s business practice, but it's in
my approach to Commodore.  I look at the technical problems, business
problems, etc. and make a decision.  Do I attempt to address the technical
problems or do I forget about Commodore.  At this point, I choose to address
the continuance of the Amiga, and I do so because I believe that it is
something worth doing, and something that will yield success. If I did not
believe this, I would have left the company, plain and simple.  Obviously,
not everything is under my control, but I know what I have to work with over
the next year or so, and I judge it adequate to achieve the necessary goals.

Randell Jesup:
Personally, I don't listen to the doomsayers... ;-)
Commodore has gone through a rough stretch recently.  However, things
are starting to look brighter.  CD32 has done pretty well in Europe for
a brand-new machine (far better than 3DO has done here).  A1200 sales
have picked up.  Financially, Commodore is in better shape than it was.
Not good shape, but better.  The cost-cutting, while very painful, has
given Commodore the time it needed to launch the CD32, and to continue
work on next-generation products.

I've been here since '88.  Of people in software, only one (Eric Cotton,
who manages tools and releases) has been here longer (he dates back to the
VIC-20 days).  People may not remember, but the software group was much
smaller than it is now when I got here (4 people).  Also, a number of
senior people who've left recently have gone to places like Scala, so
I wouldn't say that's entirely negative.

Also, if you follow the cable-box stuff in EETimes, etc, you'll know that
we're a player in that whole thing, since we bring a lite OS and good
NTSC graphics.  Think of an Amiga in your information-highway set-top
terminal... ;-)  There may be clouds, but a lot of them are behind us.
Certainly there are more hurdles ahead, but I think we can handle them.

*******************************************************
*
* Was there more?  Yep.. sure was!  Another 3 hours or so!
* Those 3 hours were not part of the formal conference so they were
* not recorded for editing.  Dave talked about the differences
* between SETCPU and CPU.  He talked about the future.  The only way
* to see the whole story is to join CompuServe and be there when it
* happens!
*
* This file may be freely distributed in any medium so long as the file
* remains intact with no changes -- including this notice.
* The conference was moderated by Mark D. Manes.
*
* If you wish to subscribe to CompuServe simply dial 1-800-787-RUSH.
*
* Copyright 1994 AForums Ltd.
*
*******************************************************
--


    Dale Schlott                 linx![e-mail]
    Pontiac, MI
    USA

AMIGAFUTURE
Good, and bad news... personally I'm an optomist. Wish I could find something
close to the detailed posts that appeared in the months before AGA came out.
You can get the general feel for what's happening though... looks really
exciting. The David Plesance article is here, as well as comments on articles
in AmigaReport, Amiga Shopper, and Amiga Computing.


From: [e-mail] (Thomas Christopher Maresh)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Amiga and RISC?
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 94 17:00:16 PST
Organization: The Portal System (TM)
Lines: 15

In AmigaReport 1.38, it is reported that the RISC processor of choice for the
AAA Amigas is the Hewlett Packard chip.  This is fairly reliable because it is
reported elsewhere (in AR 2.05 I think) that C= and HP have entered into an
agreement where HP will use the Amiga chipset intheir set-top boxes made for
the new wave of cable systems.  In a past Amiga report, I forget which one,
but it can also be found alone as hazy*.lha, Dave Haynie, a C= engineer
stated that the AAA models will be processor independent.  That means the same
system can use either the '060 (which they ARE planning to use--but don't
compare it to the RISC, compare it to the Pentium) or the RISC.  JUst pop in
the right card.
DSP is also in the future, which can handle all the sound requirements and
such, although 16 bit sound is there without it.  24 bit graphics are also
built in.  And a 110 Mhz or Khz (I forget which) vertical refresh rate. And
a super fast floppy interface (can handle single speed CD-ROM drives). It's al
there, it's just a matter of getting it to the market.


>From From: [e-mail] (Kenneth Jamieson)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: FYI: Info on future Amigas
Date: 4 Mar 1994 00:00:45 -0000
Organization: Xanadu Enterprises Inc.
Lines: 65

This is posted FYI only - any argument flame baiting I wanted to do I did on
the .advocacy groups.

=============================================================

Amiga Shopper
(printed in England)
[from the makers of Amiga Format]
Issue 34
February 1994
Page 16 (Article is on pages 14-17, 20-21, 24, 26, & 28-29

David Pleasance, Commodore UK (recently installed) Managing Director

"I think in this country we've been spectacularly unsuccessful at properly
positioning the A4000, A3000 or even the A2000, for that matter, as a
serious machine."

To which he adds, bullishly: "I can absolutely promise you that is all set
to change."

Seeing that Microsoft have more or less ignored the Amiga, how does he
view the future?  Given that the machine is going from strength-to-strength,
it seems reasonable to suppose that the big guns cannot afford to ignore it
for much longer.  So is it likely that Microsoft will ever develop for the
Amiga?

"No," he replies with confidence, "but they won't need to."

"The new generation of machines have a RISC core, will be DOS compatible
and will run Windows NT.  We're taking a 64-bit RISC processor, adding to
it a 3D rendering engine with texture mapping and so on -- all included on
the chip -- and we're wrapping it with the AAA chip set.  We're currently
predicting a performance ratio compared to AA [AGA] chip set of somewhere
between 10 & 20 times current speeds.  This will form the heart of new
high-end workstations and you'll have full compatibility with DOS -- no
bridgeboards required."

It sounds to good to be true, but Pleasance claims the new machines will
run all the current Amiga software too.  "The head of Research and
Development team, Lou Eggbrecht, is the best in the business.  He was head
of the design team that produced all the chips for the IBM PC; he also
worked for Franklin computers [no connection with Steve Franklin], a
company that very nearly produced a Macintosh clone, before going bankrupt
a few years ago.

"Virtually anything you care to mention, he's been involved with.  Moveover,
the first-pass silicon on AAA was over 95% functional -- a performance that
was previously unheard of."


===============================================================

--
                     Too tired to think of a funny .signature.
                                Kenneth Jamieson
        [e-mail] / [e-mail] / [e-mail]
                     Via Linux ALPHA 0.99 PL14l - Thanks Linus!



From: [e-mail] (C.P. Brown)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: What can AAA do?
Date: 13 Mar 1994 05:53:08 GMT
Organization: U of Cambridge Computer Lab, UK
Lines: 37

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Dan Stephenson) writes:
|> I am a PC user, and I have some question about what AAA is supposed to
|> be able to do.  Would someone who knows post the answers?
|>
|> 1) How much video memory will it have, minimally?  Will it still use
|> the chip/fast paradigm?  What kinds of resolution and color depth
|> combinations can it do for using the *Workbench*?  And elsewise?  Are
|> these interlaced modes?

No idea about the minimum they'll ship it with (I doubt it will be less than 2
megs though). AAA can take upto 16 Megabytes of CHIP RAM. This can be DRAM, VRAM
or a mixture of both, mixed on half megabyte boundaries. You'll be able to run
Workbench in 1280*1024 in 16 bits. That's non-interlaced. Interlace it to get
1280*2048 if you wish. I have no idea if Commodore will make higher resoloutions
available in lower colour depths. It should be able to do 1024*1024 (1024*2048
interlaced) in 24 bit, and 1280*1024 non-interlaced HAM-10 pseudo 24 bit.

|>
|> 2) Will AAA have some common denominator 'crap' video mode suitable for
|> 'video work'?  (Crap=not good for desktop work)

Video is very important to the Amiga, hence Triple-A will have all the standard
PAL and NTSC modes that ECS has. This also means that low end systems will be
able to use a TV set.

|>
|> 3) How will it compare in speed to some of the ultra fancy PC and
|> Macintosh video cards?  I saw a PCI's Pentium and a Radius-board'd Mac
|> on Computer Chronicles last week, and they were IMPRESSIVE!

Initial reports are that it's very fast. It shifts 24 bit images around
substantially faster than AGA shifts 8 bit images around.

--
     //    Chris Brown.  finger [e-mail] for my PGP public key.
 \\ //
  \X/ Amiga A1200, 6MB RAM, 85MB HD, 25MHz 68882, 262144 colours on screen.


Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
From: [e-mail] (richard mallender xd/hd 1703)
Subject: AAA Development Suspended, was Re: PowerPc-vs-AAA-speed??
Organization: Ericsson Telecom AB
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 14:25:26 GMT
Lines: 32

Hello folks.  As I understand it you're all quite right about future Amigas
using the HP-PA Risc chip, however I've Just been looking through the April
edition of Amiga Computing magazine, & there was some news about the future
of the Amiga graphics chipset.  It says that since Commodore are still
operating under financial constraints, development of the AAA chipset has
been suspended for the time being in order to concentrate on the CD32.
There also seems to be some sentiment that continuing with a proprietry
chipset which has been in development for around 3.5 years, and will initially
only appear in low volume sales workstations, is a waste of time and money.
Since the next generation Amigas are to use the PCI card standard, why not
use an off the shelf graphics card ?  The article mentions an experimental
system hooked up to a Cirrus Logic graphics card.

Anyone know 'owt else about this ?

If C= *do* go for an off the shelf graphics card, then to maintain
compatibility they'll have to abstract their graphics routines away from
the hardware - and about time too !


Richard.
..

======================================================================
Ericsson Telecommunications Ltd.  The above represents my own opinions
Burgess Hill, Sussex,          and in no way represents those of
ENGLAND                  t'company.
======================================================================





From: [e-mail] (Reginald Martin u)
Subject: Re: AAA not good enough?
Organization: Wilfrid Laurier University
Date: Wed, 16 Feb 1994 00:12:50 GMT
Lines: 23

Christian Moen ([e-mail]) wrote:
:    New competition would certainly make Commodore think twice about
:    not-including any 3D hardware on AAA(as far as I know there is
:    none, but I could be wrong).
:
: You're right, there isn't any 3D hardware in the AAA chipset and there
: won't be either since the AAA development probably is in the finishing
: stages.

I think it's pretty old 'news' that there will _probably_ be 3D hardware
included with AAA. Here's a quote from Chris Ludwig (CBM developer):

  "We are working towards having 3D calls in the OS that will allow people
to do 3D work quickly.  From there it's a reasonable logical extension
that we can throw in some hardware to assist that library.
  "It's something that we felt we needed ever since we saw the
specifications for 3DO - it just makes sense.  It's amazing how much time,
money and energy gets thrown into coming up with better games.  With a
machine like 3DO, this seems to be the real goal"

  -February issue of Amiga Shopper

Reg Martin

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: [e-mail] ("Dave Mansell")
Subject: C= resume manufacture of A1200 and 1084S for US market
Organization: Citadel Software Limited
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 20:08:09 GMT
Lines: 8

C= have resumed production of the US versions of the A1200 and 1084S
monitors. Supplies of 1084S monitors should be available about now,
A1200's should begin shipping again in April. Good news for a change guys!

----------------------------------------------------------
Dave Mansell - Citadel Software Ltd
FABRICATI DIEM PVNK - Motto of the Ankh-Morpork City Watch
----------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Michaela Baginski)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Amiga and RISC?
Date: 26 Feb 1994 17:37:47 +1100
Organization: University of Wollongong, NSW, Australia.
Lines: 17

    I'm not too specific with data about XXXXX chip etc, but on the
topic that you are talking about, from the editorial of AUSTRALIAN
COMMODORE AND AMIGA REVIEW, I quote the following:-

    "It is true. The year 1994 may herald the end of Motorola powered
Amigas. By 1995, Amiga owners will join the masses who are headed into RISC
arena. A 64-bit RISC based machine sporting new AAA graphics and sound
technology is expected to be released by the end of the year. It will,
according to several reliable sources (article doesn't say who), run
Windows NT - and thus MS-DOS applications."

    All that from February 1994 edition, page 5, editorial. I hope that
is the info you wanted (or didn't want) to hear.

    What will happen to the AGA chipset?, will it be another CDTV from
Commodore?. Who knows, only the future will tell. Bye.

// Just to show you I'm objective, here's a harsh critique... //

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
From: [e-mail] (Paul Ross)
Subject: A-5000 / RISC  Impatience Blues!
Organization: ProLine [pro-ahamt] -- Stillwater, MN
Date: Fri, 4 Mar 1994 17:11:08 GMT
Lines: 41

              CRAVING THE RISC-BLEEDING EDGE

 I am thinking seriously about getting the PPC-601 when it comes out, and
just skipping the A-5000 due to the inordinate delay.  The PC industry is
on a 6-month product cycle, and it is just no longer acceptable for a
manufacturer to be on some sort of TWO YEAR+ product cycle.  The PPC601
does appear to be an adequate machine.  I would prefer the 801 but there is
a real price premium for the performance increase.  I am kind of surprised
that there are such extravagent claims for the increased performance since
the actual clock speed increase is not that substantial
percentagewise...what's going on?  Does the 801 version have some kind of
enhanced memory sub-system?

             PPC-DEBUT IMPLICATIONS FOR C=

The PowerMACs sound impressive.  I think the debut of the new PowerMac
601/801 at the projected prices will, unfortunately for C=, make the 1995
introduction date of the A-5000/PA-RISC a futile exercise.  Most of us will
have switched rather than wait.  There is no engineering reason I know of
why C= should not introduce the PA-RISC machine FIRST rather than the 68060
version.  After all, if Haynie is to be believed (and I do) the Motherboard
is done, and there is just some tinkering being done on AAA sound-subsytem
design in the chip, and it is now at second-pass silicon.  Probably will be
completely functional and ready for production next month after an
appropriate bug-test period.  So an loaded A-5000/PA-RISC could be done
THEN...RTG & all.  Immediately.  They could sell em for $4,000 and get away
with it easily, after all, compare that price to an actual Hewlett-Packard
machine...or the PPC801 machines.  But if they wait a year, they may as
well forget it.  The PA-RISCs have been out a couple years now, and
Z-III/PCI motherboard architecture is chip-independent, and RISC-ready. The
OS is ready. They should do it NOW, and sell it for what the market will
bear...after all, they do that NOW with 4000s.

        INTERMEDIATE INSANITY:  VARIATIONS UPON THE A-4000
The engineering time and dollars being spent on adapting the A-5000 cpu and
AAA subsystems to the A-4000 is a decision that is quite simply beyond my
comprehension.  WHY????? Dollars and credibility are scarce with C=, and to
do that intermediate variation of the architecture is simply GOOFY!!!!

Internet: [e-mail]


HDDRIVE
From: [e-mail] (Saleem Khan)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.reviews
Subject: REVIEW: Power Computing XL 1.76Meg floppy drive
Date: 25 Feb 1994 21:44:52 GMT
Organization: The Amiga Online Review Column - ed. Daniel Barrett
Lines: 172
Sender: [e-mail] (comp.sys.amiga.reviews moderator)
Approved: [e-mail]
Keywords: hardware, floppy drive, high-density, commercial


PRODUCT NAME

    Power Computing XL 1.76Meg floppy drive


BRIEF DESCRIPTION

    A drive for the Amiga that can read/write high density floppy disks.
Not 100% compatible with the Chinon drive, but it CAN read/write disks from
an A4000 internal drive.


AUTHOR/COMPANY INFORMATION

    Company:    Power Computing
    Address:    Unit 8 Railton Road
            Woburn Road Ind. Estate
            Kempston
            Bedford
            MK42 7PN
            UK

    Telephone:    [phone] (Voice)
            [phone] (Fax)


LIST PRICE

    XL Internal:  75 UK pounds + P&P
    XL External:  85 UK pounds + P&P.


SPECIAL HARDWARE AND SOFTWARE REQUIREMENTS

    HARDWARE

        Any Amiga computer.


    SOFTWARE

        AmigaDOS Release 2.0 or better


COPY PROTECTION

    None.


MACHINE USED FOR TESTING

    Amiga 1200, 2MB Chip RAM.
    340 megs Western Digital Cavier (I think that's Cavier) :)
    AmigaDOS 3.0

    Amiga A500+, 2Meg Chip RAM.

    The external version of the drive was used for this review.


INSTALLATION

    Very simple -- just plug it in and go, if all you want to ever do is
read.  However, if you would like to WRITE to high density disks, then you
MUST install a software patch on your machine.  The patch is a 15K file that
seems to do a "diskchange" so drives that have floppies in them grind when
the patch is run (only when the patch is run -- once run, all is as normal).

REVIEW

    If you have ever bought the Power Computing 888* range of drives,
then you'll know what this drive looks like.  I was thinking of scanning a
picture for you folks and I'll have to see what Dan thinks about this.

    [MODERATOR'S NOTE:  Dan thinks its a fine idea.  - Dan]

It plugs right into the external drive port on the Amiga.  One thing that
puzzles me is that if it is an CBM compatible drive (it is, as you don't need
to run the patch if you want only to read disks) why doesn't Amax 2 like
this drive?  (More on this later.)

    I have had this drive for a few months, and it's a good, solid drive.
I've had no real problems except it SEEMED a little less stable under
AmigaDOS 2.0 then it is now under 3.0.  I don't know, it could be me, but now
I get fewer errors with writing to disks.

    When I first got the drive, one disk in every 10 would fail (that's
high density disks, and they were branded).  Now that I run AmigaDOS 3.0
(A1200) and setpatch 40.14, the drive seems to be A LOT more stable.

    In use, it is faster than the internal drive in the A4000 because it
is a full speed drive.  It uses RAM chips and custom logic chips to buffer
the data so Paula does not have to lose any of the data.  Owners of the OLD
880* drives might be able to upgrade -- phone Power Computing and ask if they
can upgrade your drive.  It must be the Sony type:  you can open your drive
says Power Computing in the ads.


DOCUMENTATION

    Small booklet of "A5" size.  It would have been better if they
mentioned exactly what the patch does! :(


LIKES AND DISLIKES

    It's a shame a patch is needed -- good thing I have a hard drive!  I
used to run the patch from floppy disks and it was a pain!


COMPARISON TO OTHER SIMILAR PRODUCTS

    I know from magazine reviews that most reviewers say the KCS drive
is a better buy.  The KCS drive has more features (copiers, etc.) installed
and is supposed to be faster.  The KCS unit also has custom drivers that
allow even AmigaDOS 1.2 based Amigas to write/read all filesystems from
FFS to DCFS!.


BUGS

    Only the Amax one found.  If I insert a disk, it comes back and says
"disk is damaged."  Now if I remove the disk and put it back into the drive,
it works?!  Also, if I re-start the Mac from the menus, my external drive
won't function (put a disk in, and the Mac won't know that you did). 8-(


VENDOR SUPPORT

    Power Computing used to have a BBS (Gold fingers), but now it won't
respond.  I did mention the problems I had, and no-one helped (well another
user did).  So I don't know if they REALLY care too much.


WARRANTY

    The drive has a one year warranty.


CONCLUSIONS

    Overall it's a decent drive, if you can live with the quirks.  I can,
and it's also great when I have to back up the hard drive.  Recently, I tried
the freeware "SpareDiskDevice" package and it worked great.  High density
disks format to 1966K per disk.  The disks that would not format, I tried to
format from Directory Opus, and it formatted them fine (?).


COPYRIGHT NOTICE

    This review written by Duggy.  Do with it what you like, but just
don`t say YOU wrote it. :)

    If you would like to amend it, contact me FIRST!

  ....
 '||''|.   [e-mail]
  ||   ||  ... ...    ... .   ... . .... ...
  ||    ||  ||  ||   || ||   || ||   '|.  |
  ||    ||  ||  ||    |''     |''     '|.|
 .||...|'   '|..'|.  '||||.  '||||.    '|
                    .|....' .|....' .. |
                      ''''    ''''   ''

---

   Daniel Barrett, Moderator, comp.sys.amiga.reviews
   Send reviews to:    [e-mail]
   Request information:    [e-mail]
   Moderator mail:    [e-mail]
   Anonymous ftp site:  math.uh.edu, in /pub/Amiga/comp.sys.amiga.reviews


STUDIO
From: [e-mail] (Christian Sarrasin)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.applications,comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Any drivers for the HP 1200C printer (PageStream also)?
Date: 23 Feb 1994 12:18:13 GMT
Organization: Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne
Lines: 201

M. Shawn Easter ([e-mail]) wrote:
: This is a repost. I just purchased the HP 1200C printer to use with
: my Amiga 2000. I also have PageStream 2.22.
:

There is a driver, called Studio, from Wolf Faust, Germany, which seems also
to be rather a complete printing package rather than a simple driver. Here is
a reply I got when I sent an e-mail to the author, reprinted without his permis-
sion (but I bet he won't mind...)

I haven't ordered it yet, but I'm going to in the next few days...

Christian

----- Cut here ---- cut here ---- cut here ---- cut here ---- cut here ----- cut here ----

>From [e-mail] Mon Feb 14 09:19:16 1994
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Date:     Sat, 12 Feb 1994 03:04:06 +0100
Message-Id: <[e-mail]>
From: [e-mail] (Wolf Faust)
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Studio for DJ550C
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 6373
Status: RO


:I know you are the author of the Studio package, which to my
:knowledge includes drivers for the HP Deskjet families of printer.

Yep

:1) Does it handle 24bit IFF files. How well?

You can print them from disk and yes, they are printed in 24 bit
accuracy. Lot's of dither methods to choose from and more...

:2) I have heard it also includes a custom driver for PageStream. Does
:   this one also perform well on 24bit IFF? Is is fast enough? Will the
:   driver be updated for use with PageStream 3.0?

Can't say about PageStream 3.0. The Studio PageStream driver was
mainly written because the original driver was not available by
that time and because you can't control things like page
size/shingling and that with the orig. PageStream driver.

Otherwise the Studio driver is usualy 25% faster, but when it
comes to images, you only get better images if you use the
printers shingling/depletion/gamma functions offered by the Studio
PGS driver. The driver allready gets dithered data from PGS and
thus can't do dither of it's own.

:3) Are there any 550C specific drivers? Not just 500C which will print
:   black out of the three others colors...

Studio comes with both, a 4 color and 3 color driver. And of
course, it's for the DJ550C.

:4) How much does the package cost? Is it available through a reseller
:   in Switzerland or somewhere near or can I order it directly from you?
:   I'd prefer an english version over the german version, if it is
:   available.

Yes, you can buy directly from me.  Price for the english version
is DM 110.  The swiss distributor does sell the german version
produced by MacroSystem Germany.

Otherwise here is some data... Studio V2 will be released this
summer...

Known distributors are:

Germany:                            Switzerland:

MS MacroSystem Computer GmbH        ProMigos
Friedrich-Ebert-Str. 85             Hauptstr. 37 & 50
58454 Witten                        5212 Hausen/Brugg
Tel: [phone]                    Tel: [phone]
Fax: [phone]                    Fax: [phone]
(German Version)                    (German Version)

England:                            North America:

JAM                                 MacroSystem US
75 Greatfields Drive                24282 Lynwood Suite 101
Uxbridge                            Novi
UB8 3QN                             MI 48374
Tel: [phone]                    Tel: [phone]
(English Version)                   Fax: [phone]
                                    (English Version)

Netherland:                         Belgien:

MacroSystem NL                      Click! b.v.b.a.
Tromplaan 1                         Boomsesteenweg 468
3951 CL-Maarn                       2610 Wilrijk
Tel: [phone]                     Tel: [phone]
     023-296166                     Fax: [phone]
Fax: [phone]                     (English Version)
(English Version)

Studio
------
- prints IFF ILBM pictures from disk
- does not require $&%$ MBytes memory! You can print 24 MB
  pictures with a plain 1MB Amiga.
- supports most of the known IFF ILBM formats, including HAM8,
  IFF24, HAM, EHB and color palettes up to 256 colors.
- Allows you to print poster size images spread over multiple
  pages.
- number of copies can be defined
- Using  Studio you  can  print 24 bit-planes of color accuracy
  on  a  color  printer  (for  instance CanonBJC800).  If you have a
  black and white only printer, then you can print with 8 bit-planes
  of grey scale accuracy.
- multiple jobs can be defined and printed in background
  (estimated print time and more will be displayed)
- ink compensation does correct ink impurities
- color adjustment (gamma, contrast, brightnes, weights,...)
- Free defineable ordered dither routines. Following ordered
  dither matrices are already included:
  Haltone-A, Halftone-B, Ordered-A, Ordered-B, Spiral, Horizontal,
  Vertical, Bck-Brick, Fwd-Brick
- Three error diffusion dither routines:
  Floyd Steinberg, Jarvis, Stucki
- Two serpentine blue noise dither routines are included:
  30% random weight, 50% random weight
- ARexx Interface
- font independent user interface (KS 2.04 style)
- works with most printer drivers (non striping drivers are
  supported!)
- automatic use of improved code on 68020/30/40 processors
- supports multiinterface cards

LaserDriver (included with Studio)
----------------------------------
- supports all PCL 3-5e laser printers (including HP 4,4L,4M,4Si)
[deleted]

DeskDriver (included with Studio)
---------------------------------
- drives all Deskjet printers (including DJ550C, DJ510 and DJ1200!)
- 256 greyshades (printer drivers are normaly limited to 16!)
- color adjustment with 24 bit accuracy and 256 shades per color
  component. Easy control over gamma correction, brightness,
  contrast and more...
- Media control (plain, glossy, transparancy, and special paper)
- ink compensation correcting ink impurities
- control  over typeface (the "DeskPref" preferences program does
  contains a database of the latest typeface base values, allowing you to
  calculate a typeface family)
- total control over page size and margins, line wrap, printer
  direction, quality, landscape....
- includes a nice font independent preferences program
- free definable dither routines. Allready included:
  Ordered-A, Ordered-B (a adopted ordered dither curing dot gain
  problems), Halftone-A, Halftone-B, Line, Spiral and more...
  The defineable dither improve the output quality daramticly.
- mirror function for T-Shirt printings...
- timeout  can  be defined, avoiding this nasty "printer trouble"
  requester.
- full control over shingling and depletion
- Job end signal
- arXon switchbox support
- automatic use of improved code on 68020/30/40 processors
- compressed graphic output does improve the speed (2-10times faster)
- includes very fast PageStream 2.xx driver wich also allows
  control over various printer settings (depletion, shingling...)
- and many more features...

PinDriver (included with Studio)
--------------------------------
- Emulations supported: Oki, Citizen, Seikosha, Epson (24 and 48 pin),
  Fujitsu, Panasonic, Nec and Star (24 and 48 pin)
[deleted]



:Christian.

--
Wolf Faust
Am Dorfgarten 10           CompuServe: 100116,1070
60435 Frankfurt            Internet  : [e-mail]
Germany                    Tel/Fax: [phone]


--
     ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                   Death to the Pixies! Here comes Frank Black
                     \\\ Stay tuned for more Rock'n'Roll ///
                    Christian Sarrasin  ([e-mail])
     ----------------------------------------------------------------------




SCREAMER
Give your A4000 running Lightwave the speed of a Cray-1 supercomputer. :)

From: [e-mail] (The Raven)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: NewTek Screamer Board ??
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 94 23:30:08 EST
Organization: Temporal Vortex BBS
Lines: 24

[e-mail] (Roman /Dostick/) writes:

> Can anyone tell something about that ?
>

 The Screamer is a parralell processor (4 R-4400 RISC chips) running at
10MHz, It is connected to an existing Toaster setup via Ether net.

 End result is that something that takes 75 hrs to render will be done in
1 hr 45 mins.

 However... THIS THING IS A MEMORY HOG!!!

 Each processor needs beaucoup RAM to function at full speed (we're
talking 64 - 128 MEGS EACH!!) That's a lot of bucks to tack onto a
$10,000 price tag for the basic unit.

 However, the 3 BETA units that are being used are tricked out.

 They are at: Foundation Imaging (Babylon 5)
              Paramount (Star Trek TNG/Viper)
              Amblin Ent. (Seaquest DSV)

 Since you asked. :)


FANTASY
Is there anything more to say? :)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: AAA machines - my realistic (?) wishes
From: [e-mail] (Eyal Teler)
Date: 1 Mar 1994 15:45:44 GMT
Organization: The Hebrew U. of Jerusalem, Computer Science Dept.
Lines: 124


Here is my view of what AAA machines should look like. It's what I consider
to be a realistic view of the possibilities, and if C= manage to do this,
I'll be happy. If C= manages to get more value for money, all the better.


Product scedule in months, with 0 being the release date for pure AAA machines.
I think that 2 months between releases is a good way to let people feel that
there's on-going development.
I assume that AAA machines will have AmigaDOS 4.

-2 - Some AAA components for A4000
 0 - A5000 base, A5000/WS
 2 - A5000 full range, CD32 to #250, FMV to #150
 3 - A5000/LC
 5 - CD32 to #200, FMV to #100, A1200 to #200
 7 - CD3D
 8 - RISC support for graphics, Open GL for AmigaDOS
10 - A2200 (CDMM)
12 - AmigaDOS for RISC, A5000/R
14 - CD64

Details of the machines:

Note: Specifications are based on the assumptions that AAA comes in two
flavours - basic and expanded, each capable of running from DRAM or VRAM.
Even if you happen to view AAA otherwise (I don't know the reality), it's
quite easy to substitute what I write below to fit your view.
Prices are in British Pounds. All prices do not include a monitor.

A5000 range - A4000-like case, PCI slots instead of ISA; AAA graphics system
    expandable; 4 SIMM sockets for Fast RAM, individual size selectable,
    from 4MB to 64MB; 2 sockets for Chip RAM, or maybe sockets on the
    graphics subsystem, also size selectable, VRAM or DRAM selectable;
    standard processor options - 68LC040@20MHz, 68040@33MHz, 68060@50MHz;
    IDE and SCSI-II on board, with the following standard HD options -
    170MB IDE, 340MB IDE, 520MB SCSI-II; Double speed CD-ROM as standard;
    FMV option; RISC processor option; NT option (with RISC CPU).
    Machines basically come with 4MB Chip RAM (DRAM or VRAM options).
    Other memory/hard disk configurations are up to the local suppliers.

A5000 base - A5000 with 68040@33MHz, expanded AAA, 4MB DRAM Chip, 4MB Fast,
    340MB IDE disk, FMV, CD-ROM. This is a mid-range AAA machine.
    Price: BP2000
    Target: A4000 owners, graphics people who cannot afford the A5000/WS

A5000/WS - Workstation model. 68060@50MHz, RISC Processor with NT support,
    expanded AAA, 8MB VRAM Chip, 8MB Fast, 520MB SCSI-II disk, FMV, CD-ROM.
    Price: BP4000
    Target: Magazine reviewers. Possibly commercial graphics producers.

A5000/LC - Low Cost model. 68LC040@20MHz, basic AAA, 4MB DRAM Chip, 170MB
    IDE disk, CD-ROM.
    Price: BP1000
    Target: All Amiga lovers. Multimedia and low cost video users.
        Nice general purpose machine for a reasonable price.

A5000/R - A5000 machines with a RISC CPU only (no 680x0). The CPU would
    probably support FMV in software, so all A5000/R machines have FMV.


CD3D - CDTV 2. 68EC040@20MHz, basic AAA, 4MB DRAM Chip, CD-ROM, FMV, normal
    interfaces + remote control and LCD panel. IDE but no SCSI, 1 SIMM
    socket for Fast RAM, 4MB to 64MB. 32K flash (/static) RAM.
    One propriety expansion slot.
    Upgrading RAM or installing a hard disk invalidates warranty.
    Price: BP400
    Target: Pitted against 3DO, Video-CD players. May be a bit more
        expensive than either, but 3DO does not play FMV as standard
        and Video-CD players won't play games. CD3D would take
        advantage of A5000 games (ie DOOM clones :). The machine
        is not intended to compete directly against cheap games
        machines (the CD32 is still Commodore's console).

A2200 - CDMM, the computer version of the CD3D. It's a CD3D with added
    keyboard, disk drive, 170MB hard disk. Also available as an upgrade
    to the CD3D. The disk drive is possibly in place of the LCD
    display / infra-red detector.
    Price: BP600
    Target: Amiga people who didn't move to the A5000/LC because they
        thought it was too expensive. The A1200 of the future.
        Home multimedia users, games players who want some more
        serious stuff with their games and Video-CDs.
        For people who think that IDE and no MMU is perfectly fine.


CD64 - CD32 2. RISC CPU, Expanded AAA, 4MB Chip VRAM, 4MB Chip DRAM.
    FMV with CPU. (The specification could be lower if prices don't
    come down enough.)
    Price: BP300 (hopefully not more)
    Target: Games players, Amiga lovers who bought a PowerPC machine,
        and want that warm feeling of an Amiga product again ;-)
        Pitted against other RISC and 64-bit consoles.
        The first ever HDTV games console :-)


General notes:

- Prices take into account the decrease in component prices (RAM, CPU, hard
  disks...) over time.
- The lowest speed of a 68xx040 is 20MHz, which is why this speed is used in
  the new Amigas. A 68EC040 costs ~$50 today in 10k quantities. This should
  allow reasonable cost machines which have a 68040 family processor as a
  minimum.
- I don't know what the initial speed of the 68060 will really be, but it
  will be at least 50MHz.
- The 68060 processor board would probably include an external cache.
- 4MB of Chip RAM is the absolute minimum for an AAA machine. Even AGA machines
  can struggle with 2MB, and the higher resolutions and better sound quality
  of AAA make 4MB Chip a minimum.
- Basic AAA with DRAM should be enough for a video based machine, such as the
  CD3D. At normal resolutions (ie low-res 24-bit colour) there should be enough
  bandwidth left for processing. The on-chip cache should also help.
- Note that all machines come with a CD-ROM drive. I see this as important.
- The RISC chip in the CD64 should be a version of the one in the A5000/R.
  This version should have a very low cost.
- There might also be an A5000/T (floor sTanding) machine, but it would
  probably take C= about 2 years to make the case ;-)


    ET

--
Unlike some other ETs, I can really phone home


SPREADSHEET
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.applications
From: [e-mail] (Simon Raybould)
Subject: SC spreadsheet for the amiga.
Organization: Fulcrum Communications Ltd., Birmingham, England
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 1994 18:34:30 GMT
Lines: 25


I do not read this group, but have been ask by someone that does to
inform you of the SC amiga port that I did a while back. I have
recently improved it and will be uploading it to Aminet probably
tomorrow.

I am of the understanding that there have been a few people looking
for a simple spreadsheet for the amiga. In my oppinion, this is the
best I have seen for casual SS users like myself. That is why I ported
it.

The port was simply to compile it and link against my curses library.
I will get the SC sources off a unix site and diff to be sure I made
no changes. If I had to alter the original SC source, I will upload
that as well.


Sie

--
===============================================================================
Simon J Raybould ([e-mail])         Senior Real Time Software engineer
  "Is that your long distance ceremonial cream eclair administration unit ?"
Fujitsu Fulcrum Telecommunications Ltd., 149 Fordrough Lane, Birmingham, B9 5FL
===============================================================================

TRANSPUTER
Damn, I wish I had that article... can't seem to find it anywhere. CeBIT
should have a demo, I hear... been chatting with a guy who knows the people
working on it.


From: [e-mail] (SChampion)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.hardware
Subject: Re: Which 64-bit RISC CPU will the AAA mac
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 94 18:57:31 GMT
Organization: Hampshire College
Lines: 29

In Article <2kdjj8$[e-mail]>
[e-mail] (Alexis David Dinno) writes:
>>The actual article on the transputer was posted already, but the neat thing,
>>
>>Lets see your MacBigot and Windoze Not There dorfs choke when you tell
>>them you have multiple RISC CPUs running at supercomputer speeds,
>                        ^^^^^^^^^
>
>
>The 040 (which some of them thar transputer boards are rumored to run with)
>are CISC processors (and damn proud of it too).

    Nope, it doesn't use 68Ks.  At least not in the 4 articles I have
read about it.  It uses T900? and T9000 chips, which are RISC CPUs with the
addition of serial communications for the interaction of multiple chips.
    The reason you can can use as many CPUs as you can buy is the
on-board chip-chip communication of the Transputers.
    An important distiction that should be made is that the WARP is the
board, the Transputer the chip.  Transputers have also been used in other
application.  As far as I know, there is nothing available to make use of
the Transputer on either Macs or PC, certainly not integrated with the OS.
This is a Workstation - SuperComputer thing.  Which, I think, most everyone
here would agree, the Amiga always has been, just not in this sense of the
word.  :)

/*   Stephen Champion                  |       Amiga 3000/25        */
/*   [e-mail]      |     275Mb HD + 10Mb RAM    */
/*   Hampshire College - Amherst, MA   |  USR Courier Dual Standard */
#include "Text:Legal/Standard_Disclaimer"


PPC
Boo. Hiss. Apple. 'nuff said. :)

Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.advocacy
Subject: Re: Commodore Can -- PowerPC Edu. Prices

By-Tor Blackwing ([e-mail]) wrote:
: This is the little sales thing my uni just sent me regarding PowerMacs.
: The price looks okay to me...

: From [e-mail] Thu Mar 10 09:02:18 1994
: Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 21:47:29 -0800 (PST)
: From: "D. Bret Sanders" <[e-mail]>
: To: UoR Users <[e-mail]>
: Subject: New Macintosh PowerPC's

:                        New from Apple!
:                     The Macintosh PowerPC

: Compatible with current Macintosh hardware and software, these new
: RISC-based computers will offer incredible performance increases over
: today's Macintosh!  With optional SoftWindows software, these computers
: will run MS-DOS and Windows software at 486 speeds!  Come to the Jones
: Computer Center for a demonstration of this new technology.  We will have
: demos set up the week of March 14th.  Call the computer sales office at
: extension 3945 or 4965 for more information.

: PowerMacintosh 6100/60:
:     60MHz PowerPC 601 microprocessor with FPU and 32K cache
:     8 MB of RAM, expandable to 72 MB
:     Slot for processor-direct or NuBus expansion card
:     Optional internal CD-ROM drive
:     On-board Ethernet networking port
:     Built-in speech recognition and telephony capabilities
:     16-bit stereo audio input and output
:     Price: $1731 (8/160 configuration - monitor & keyboard additional)

: PowerMacintosh 7100/66:
:     66MHz PowerPC 601 microprocessor with FPU and 32K cache
:     8 or 16 MB of RAM, expandable to 136MB
:     Three NuBus slots for expansion cards
:     Optional internal CD-ROM drive
:     On-board Ethernet networking port
:     Built-in speech recognition and telephony capabilities
:     Price: $2749 (8/250 configuration - monitor & keyboard additional)

: PowerMacintosh 8100/80:
:     80MHz PowerPC 601 microprocessor with FPU and 32K cache
:     256K level-2 cache
:     8 or 16 MB of RAM, expandable to 264MB
:     Double-speed SCSI for internal device
:     Three NuBus slots for expansion cards
:     Optional internal CD-ROM drive
:     On-board Ethernet networking port
:     Built-in speech recognition and telephony capabilities
:     Price: $3938 (8/250 configuration - monitor & keyboard additional)

: Whatever.

: Hope for good AAA!!

: By-Tor Blackwing, Slayer of Dozens

: Windoze Error #56:  Operator fell asleep while waiting.
 // Cracks me up every time.

Subject: PowerPC Mac Specs!
From: [e-mail], Clark University
Date: 18 Feb 94 10:57:57 -0600

Here you go!  I found these somewere and this is all I know!

                        Fritz
====================================================

Power Macintosh 6100/60

Processor: 60-MHz PowerPC 601 RISC processor; integrated math
        coprocessor; 32K on-chip cache

Memory:    8MB of RAM, Expandable to 72MB
           o 8MB on the logic board
           o Two SIMM slots support 4MB, 8MB, 16MB or 32MB
                 SIMMs

Video expansion: DRAM video support

Video expansion: DRAM video support

Disk storage:   o 1.4MB Apple SuperDrive
                o 160MB or 250MB internal hard disk drive
                o Space for an internal 5.25-inch storage
                         device, such as an optional AppleCD 300i Plus
                         CD-ROM drive.

Networking: Built-in LocalTalk and high-speed Ethernet
        connections; AppleTalk networking software

Display capabilities: Built in support for 32,768 colors on
        the Apple ColorPlus 14-inch Display, Macintosh Color
        Display, and Apple AudioVison 14-inch Display; 256
        colors on the Macintosh 16-inch Color Display Expansion
        Capabilities: Expansion slot for 7-inch NuBus card or
        processor-direct card (requires adapter card); high-
        performance SCSI supports up to seven SCSI devices
        performance SCSI supports up to seven SCSI devices

Ports:  Two serial ports (both can be used with Apple's
        GeoPort Telecom Adapter), SCSI port, Apple Desktop Bus
        port, Monitor port that supports an Apple AudioVison
        Display or other display

Sound:  Stereo sound-input/output ports

Option configurations: Optional Power Macintosh 6100/60AV
        configuration available; SoftWindows software optional.

============================================================
Power Macintosh 7100/66

Processor: 66-MHz PowerPC 601 RISC Processor; integrated math
        coprocessor; 32K on-chip cache


Memory:    8MB of RAM, Expandable to 136MB
           o 8MB on the logic board
           o Four SIMM slots support 4MB, 8MB, 16MB or 32MB
                 SIMMs

Video expansion: 1MB of VRAM, expandable to 2MB

Disk storage:   o 1.4MB Apple SuperDrive
                o 250MB or 500MB internal hard disk drive
                o Space for an internal 5.25-inch storage
                         device, such as an optional AppleCD 300i Plus
                         CD-ROM drive.

Networking: Built-in LocalTalk and high-speed Ethernet
        connections; AppleTalk networking software

Display capabilities: Built in support for 32,768 colors on

Display capabilities: Built in support for 32,768 colors on
        the Apple ColorPlus 14-inch Display, Macintosh Color
        Display, and Apple AudioVison 14-inch Display and

 Macintosh 16-inch Color Display; 256 colors on the Apple
        Multiple Scan 20 Display; with additional VRAM, support
        16.7 million colors on the Macintosh 16-inch Color
        Display and 32,768 colors on the Apple Multiple Scan 20
        Display

Expansion Capabilities: Expansion slot for 7-inch NuBus card
        or processor-direct card (requires adapter card); high-
        performance SCSI supports up to seven SCSI devices

Ports:  Two serial ports (both can be used with Apple's
        GeoPort Telecom Adapter), SCSI port, Apple Desktop Bus
        port; dual monitor support with one monitor port that
        supports and Apple AudioVision Display or other display,
        and one standard monitor port

        and one standard monitor port

Sound:  Stereo sound-input/output ports

Option configurations: Optional Power Macintosh 7100/66AV
        configuration available; SoftWindows software optional.

============================================================
Power Macintosh 8100/80

Processor: 80-MHz PowerPC 601 RISC Processor; integrated math
        coprocessor; 32K on-chip cache and 256K memory cache

Memory:    8MB of RAM, Expandable to 264MB
           o 8MB on the logic board
           o Eight SIMM slots support 4MB, 8MB, 16MB or 32MB
                 SIMMs



Video expansion: 2MB of VRAM, expandable to 4MB

Disk storage: o 1.4MB Apple SuperDrive
              o 250MB, 500MB or 1GB internal hard disk drive
              o Space for an internal 5.25-inch storage
                    device, such as an optional AppleCD 300i Plus
                    CD-ROM drive.

Networking: Built-in LocalTalk and high-speed Ethernet
        connections; AppleTalk networking software

Display capabilities: Built in support for 16.7 million
        colors on the Apple ColorPlus 14-inch Display, Macintosh
        Color Display, and Apple AudioVison 14-inch Display and
        Macintosh 16-inch Color Display; 32,768 colors on the
        Apple Multiple Scan 20 Display; with additional VRAM,
        support 16.7 million colors on the Apple Multiple Scan

        support 16.7 million colors on the Apple Multiple Scan
20      Display

Expansion Capabilities: Expansion slot for 7-inch NuBus card
        or processor-direct card (requires adapter card); high-
        performance SCSI supports up to seven SCSI devices

Ports:  Two serial ports (both can be used with Apple's
        GeoPort Telecom Adapter), SCSI port, Apple Desktop Bus
        port; dual monitor support with one monitor port that
        supports and Apple AudioVision Display or other display,
        and one standard monitor port

Sound:  Stereo sound-input/output ports

Option configurations: Optional Power Macintosh 8100/80AV
        configuration available; SoftWindows software optional.



MEDUSA
What a name! What a machine. Atarians don't have to give up hope yet.

From: [e-mail] (Craig Shore)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.atari.st
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Organization: Equinox Networks, ChCh, New Zealand.
Subject: Atari Clone
Date: Wed, 16 Feb 1994 11:55:30 +1300
Lines: 122

Noone else seems to have posted this info here (just bits of it),
 so here goes....  (I wouldn't have a clue where it came from)

Craig.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




                          <====================>

                             PANDORA/MEDUSA T40


                       ===============================

 The first 68040 Based Atari Clone, now available at LEXICOR SOFTWARE CORP.

 PANDORA/MEDUSA T40

 MC 68040 at 64 Mhz
 Internal FPU and PMMU
 Performance is around 26 MIPS, 4.5 MFLOPS

 Main bus is:
 32 Bit Data, 32 Bit Address
 Bus Clocked at 32 Mhz
 Full Bus snooping read and write

 Atari bus is:
 16 bit Data, 24 bit Address
 Bus snooping, write
 Own ACSI Address for full 32 Bit Address

 Fast RAM
 Can hold 8-128 Megabtes on board
 Write 73 Mbyte/sec
 Read  85 Mbyte/sec

 EPROM is
 2 MByte on board
 32 Bit Wide

 TOS 3.06 modified slightly

 - ST I/O Board

 -DMA
 -MIDI
 -SERIAL
 -PRINTER
 -KEYBOARD
 -FLOPPY DD, HD, ED
 -2 SERIAL PORTS (like TT Modem) (upto 115KBaud)
 -IDE Bus (12 Mb/sec)
 -ISA Bus (for own custom Graphics Board)

 (This ISA Bus will work with any ET-4000 Based Graphics Board on PC Platfor
 with the NVDI ET-4000, however NVDI ET-4000 only supports upto max. 32,000
 colors as of this date)


 Additionally you can get:

 -VME Bus
        VME Bus 16bit
        Laser Printer Port (?)
        ROM-Port
        Mega Bus
 -SCSI Board
        TT SCSI
        SCSI II
        TT Lan
 -DSP Board
        DSP96002

 and an MC68060 Board is sceduled for the year 1994


 LEXICOR SOFTWARE CORPORATION

 [phone] - [phone]



 Here's a Price Breakdown in United States Dollars, users in North America
 will have the main parts assembled in the U.S.A. as parts are a lot cheaper
 here.

 The MEDUSA T40 is ideal for the high-end Atari User. Based around TOS 3.06
 is very compatible. Following this message will be a short list of working
 programs.

 - Basic Motherboard 68040/64
 - Tower Housing
 - ST Input/Output Board

 Cost is: 2,490 U$D (Cost can vary depending on the exchange rate)

 Availability: NOW, Transport time should take no longer than 2 Weeks!

 Additionally you may purchase an ET-4000 Graphics Board 15/16bit Color
 onboard  for about another 100 U$D + NVDI ET-4000.

 A VME Bus Multiple Bus Board (see description above) for another 400 U$D

 8, 16, 32, 64 or 128 Megabytes on board, price depending on SIMMS, current
 price is around 40 U$D per megabyte.

 IDE Internal Drive will cost depending on drive size. Internal IDE, no
 external casing required.

 NOVA VME 16M Graphics Board when purchased with VME Bus (for 24bit Color)
 costs 489 U$D.

 All prices given are Recommended Retail, shipping not included!

 ---------------------------------------------------------------------
--
:: Craig Shore. Phone [phone]  (Christchurch, New Zealand.)     ::
::   (CraigS on IRC)   ::


ATARILYNX
Fix for those nasty button problems. :)

From: [e-mail] (Gregg Woodcock)
Newsgroups: rec.games.video.classic,alt.games.video.classic,rec.games.video.misc
Subject: Lynx "5200-style" joystick/button failures!
Date: 8 Feb 1994 04:26:33 GMT
Organization: Bell-Northern Research; Richardson, Texas, USA
Lines: 42

I just traded some old printers for a 2nd Atari Lynx and when it got
to me, I discovered it was "broken" (shame on you seller).  One of the
buttons was always being pressed no matter what you did.  Well I
decided to open the game up and have a look.  15 minutes later I had
it all opened up and I could not believe my eyes.  The Lynx uses the
same metal contact pressing on alternating grid traces JUST LIKE THE
ATARI 5200 USED for its buttons.  I don't know if anybody remembers
but the 5200 joysticks all died within a year of being bought due to
this poor design.  Atari knew DARN well that the 5200 button design
was crippled yet they decided to be cheap and use it again in the Lynx.
I am *VERY* disappointed in them.  Anyway, the good news is the same
fix I use for my 5200 joysticks worked on my Lynx.  I got a clean
pencil eraser and scrubbed both the metal plate (under the rubber
button) and the trace grid to clean them.  Viola; working Lynx.

For those of you who are interested in getting inside your Lynx, here
is what you do.  Gently peel back the 2 rubber grips on the back (they
come off easily and will reattach just fine if you are careful).  This
exposes 4 phillips screws.  Remove these and the one in the battery
compartment (also, remove the cartridge if one is inside, and the
batteries, too).  Pull the back cover off.  Look at the bottom thin
side of the Lynx (as in the part on the other side of the volume
control, ear plug, etc) and you will see 2 connectors on the PCB with
plastic edge connectors in them.  There is a small slot where you can
stick a flathead scresriver in to loosen the connector.  THE CONNECTOR
DOES NOT SEPARATE; it noly pops up about 1cm or so.  This allows the
plastic wire bundle to slip out so the PCB can be separated from the
rest of the assembly.

There are 4 more phillips screws that hold the screen in place.  Unscrew
these and then pull the connector to the PCB loose (it has a gender and
is an idiot-proof connection, as is the speaker connector; disconnect
it, too).  Put the screen on a smooth surface and then remove the final
6 phillips screws that hold the button cover plate on.  You now have
access to the buttons.  Just peel back the grey plastic to expose the
trace grid and the underside of the buttons.  Clean each of these with
a pencil eraser.  Before puttin any screws back, connect the 2 edge
connectors (one for the screen and one for the control I/O) back into
the PCB (it is hard to do this after the parts are screwed down) and
push the connectors into the locked position.  Then just put
everything back in the reverse order.  This procedure took me about 20
minutes and I had never seen the inside of a Lynx before.

MACEMU
No comment.

From: [e-mail] (Terry Ricketts)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.emulations
Subject: Executor
Date: 10 Mar 1994 17:20:54 GMT
Organization: UCO/Lick Observatory
Lines: 29
Summary: New Mac emulator for multiplatforms
Keywords: mac, emulation


   Just thought I would let people know that another Mac emulator is in
the works. It is called Executor, and is a software package that needs
NO ROMS or boards! At present a demo version has been released for the
PC and Alpha X Windows platforms. But the docs with it state that the
authors are planning to port it to every platform they can.

   I got the PC version and ran it on my PC at work. It ran very nicely.
The demo is setup to run for 10 minutes before shutting down. The cost
was about $99. People who are interested might want to contact the authors
and ask about a port to the Amiga.

   The source ftp site is ftp.cs.unm.edu in the directory pub/ardi. There
are several subdirectories containing the code for various platforms.
Copies of the software have been uploaded to simtel (which is the PC
equivelant of AmiNet).

   I am not a Mac person, so I do not know how well it runs Mac software,
or which programs it will not handle (if any). I am sure that as people
start to use it that info will become available. Please do not email me
asking for more info. I just got a copy of the demo and tried it out for
about an hour. I was very impressed at the end. If you have questions try
the ftp site and check with the authors there.

                    Terry
| Terry Ricketts                        |  Internet: [e-mail]
| **RETIRED** Electronics Engineer      |
| UCO/Lick Observatory                  |  Phone:    [phone]
| University of Calif, Santa Cruz       |

TI-INFO
Hey, what can I say... fascination persists, after more than a decade. Us
'99ers KNEW we had the superior system. We KNEW our manufacturer was idiotic
and couldn't market it's way out of a paper bag. We even went so far as to
create our own third party machine! What can I say? :) (Does this bear a
suspicioius resemblance to the Amiga story? Well, I spotted someone with
6 TI's and 3 Amigas talking on a board the other day... we're naturals, I
guess. Gluttons for punishment.)

From: [e-mail] (Glenn W. Bernasek)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ti
Subject: There IS a TI-99/5A!
Date: 10 Mar 1994 03:55:03 GMT
Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
Lines: 87


The following article will appear in the CLEVELAND AREA TI-99/4A
USER GROUPS newsletter.  You have three options available to you
to see the pictures.  1.  Use your imagination.  2.  Get a copy
of the newsletter.  3.  E-mail me your "snail mail" address, and
I'll be happy to send you a copy of the article, complete with
pictures of the TI-99/5A(5B).

THE FABLED TI-99/5A

By Glenn Bernasek

TI-CHIPS  Cleveland, Ohio


   What you are looking at are un-retouched pictures of an
actual TI-99/5A! Yes, you read me right! This is a real
TI-99/5A.  (Actually, these are pictures of a TI-99/5B.) I
for one didn't think there was such a thing, and I'll be the
first to admit it! (My sincere apologies to Messers Cohen
and Woodard.) It wasn't until I posted a message on
comp.sys.ti that the 99/5A didn't exist; that I received an
E-mail missive that informed me that the TI-99/5A did indeed
exist!

   The first thing I did was to send an E-mail reply
offering to buy this machine or at least get some form of
documentation.  Well TIers, needless to say, I had to settle
for some pretty super photographs, and here's a couple of
what was sent to me.

   The owner informed me that the TI-99/5A or 5B was being
developed to replace the 99/4A when TI pulled the plug.
(Probably to go head-to-head with the C-64.  THE 5A WOULD
HAVE WON HANDS DOWN!)

   Anyway, here's what was built into the TI-99/5A.

   1.  The cassette port was replaced with a Hexbus port.
(The Hexbus was an eight wire, four bit wide communication
cable.  Devices designed for the Hexbus included a floppy
disk controller, a serial port, streaming tape drive, 80
column video controller (doesn't that make your mouth
water?), portable printers and portable plotters, to name
most of them.  In a way it was a return to the old
"choo-choo train" concept.)

   2.  The insides were greatly simplified by the transition
to the 9995 processor!

   3.  The TI-99/5B also had the 32K memory expansion and
speech synthesizer built into the console.

   If you still have doubts, a chip on the motherboard
picture has a white label on it. The label reads, in part,
"99/5  11/2/83" and "TI-99/5" is prominately printed on the
circuit board!

   There are probably some of you who will be fortunate
enough to say, "Yeah, I've seen one of those before in a
garage sale or at a Faire."  You are very fortunate indeed
because there were ONLY TEN TI-99/5A(5B)s MADE!  I think this
makes the TI-99/5A a pretty rare animal, don't you?  I'll be
carrying the original photos around with me to show to those
who would like to take a look at the FABLED TI-99/5A.
Enjoy!


Glenn

[e-mail]

(Glenn W. Bernasek)

       ____    __
      | __ |  |--|
      ||  ||  |--|
      ||__||  |  |
 __  _|____|_ |TI|
|__||-----,__||__|
==================  _/--
| GEE*BEE BASICS | | o |
| ___  ____  ___ |_|___|_
||_o_||    ||_o_|||     |
||_o_||    ||_o_|||     |
||_o_||    ||_o_|||     |
|_____|    |_____||_____|

From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ti
Subject: Re: 'C' Question & REQUEST
Date: Mon, 7 Mar 94 23:24:21 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 18

Yes, there is a C compiler for the 99/4A. It is called C99 and is
available from Clint Pulley.

Greg

Newsgroups: comp.sys.ti
From: [e-mail] (Clint Pulley)
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 1994 01:18:20 GMT
Organization: Canada Centre for Inland Waters
--
Clint Pulley, Head of Computer Services               <[e-mail]>
National Water Research Institute, Environment Canada     [phone]
Canada Centre for Inland Waters, Burlington, Ontario
Minds are like parachutes. They only function when they are open. -James Dewar

From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ti
Subject: Re: TI 99/4A emulation on IBM
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 94 00:23:06 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 6

Howie, you are referring to the "PC99" project. It is being done by
Mike Wright and Mark Van Coppenolle of CaDD Electronics. It is in the so
called "stage 2" of developemnet. It can handle all sprite features,
joysticks, limited TI sounds, disk i/o and rs232 and pio. Operation is still
slow and as such a dx-50 or 66 is recommended. Several modules work. See
page 22 of the November 1993 Micropendium.


Article 130 of comp.sys.ti:
From: [e-mail] (Brad Snyder)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ti
Subject: Re: SCSI?
Date: 8 Feb 1994 04:14:19 GMT
Organization: Delphi Internet Services Corporation
Lines: 43

Joseph Cohen wrote:

  >>  Brad and Jeff White are the primary sources of info, but they refuse to
  >>  post any further clarification.:-)

Hey! I don't do PR. :-) That's up to Don O'neil. He's lurking here somewhere.
:-)

  >>  >
  >>  >It was probably decided to put the floppy logic on another card.
  >>  >

  >>  .... and add $100 or so to the price tag?

Yes, the floppy logic is on a seperate card, and for around $100 I believe.
I could be wrong on the price though. The floppy card is really amazing, and
can handle up to three floppies per card, and only takes up a single device
on the SCSI bus, leaving 6 additional slots open for hard drives or CD Roms
or even more floppy cards. If you were really crazy about having a lot of
floppies on your TI/Geneve, a single WHT SCSI adaptor could handle seven
floppy cards, each with 3 floppies attached. 2.88 meg per floppy!)
For a total of 21 floppies. And then you could still have 4 more attached if
you have a CC or Myarc FDC, (3 for a TI FDC) and 4 more if you also have an
HFDC in the system.

  >>  I bet a good number of "power users" won't have expansion box space
  >>  for TWO more cards.

The floppy logic card is NOT a pbox card. It measures only 3" x 5" and will
be bolted onto the CSI adaptor, or a floppy drive. The floppy card is
very thin and the SCSI adaptor and floppy card bolted together may only
take up one slot in the box. Maybe Don O. will tell us for sure. Since I
have an original version of the SCSI adaptor, mine will not allow the floppy
card to be bolted on. Instead I have the floppy card bolted to a 1.44 meg
floppy.

Later. . . . . . . .Brad

 ------------------+--------------------------------
 Brad Snyder       | [e-mail]
 Walnutport, PA    | [e-mail]
 USA               | BBS: First Floor : 610-760-0527



From: [e-mail]
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ti
Subject: Re: I'm looking for companies selling TI items
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 94 18:50:02 -0500
Organization: Delphi ([e-mail] email, 800-695-4005 voice)
Lines: 14

Brian,
   I run one such company making new hardware for the TI including
a SCSI card, a digital sound device, an AT keyboard interface and more
to come.
It's called/:
Western Horizon Technologies
Our address is:
10225 Jean Ellen Drive,
Gilroy, CA 95020
(408)-848-5947

There is also a list of vendors still actively providing products floating
around the networks somewhere. Maybe somenone could post it here?
Don.

From: [e-mail] (Chris Bodenmiller)
Subject: Re: I'm looking for companies selling TI items
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Lines: 16
Organization: Cedarville College, Cedarville, OH
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 04:10:37 GMT

Hi,

  Try RamCharged Computers.  They sell software from nearly all the major
developers.

RamCharged Computers
P.O. Box 81532
Cleveland, Ohio 44181
1-800-669-1214 (Orders only please)
1-216-243-1244

  They will also be selling "Who's Behind the Mexican UFO's".  Look for the
upcoming review in Micropendium.

Sincerely,
  Chris Bodenmiller



Here they are...

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